Monday, January 30, 200630
Below, we had the lawyer's view. Now we have the reality:
Rashelle Perryman's first two babies were born at Crittenden County Hospital in Marion, Ky., about 10 minutes from home.
But her third child, due in June, is to be born in Madisonville, 40 miles away in Hopkins County, because rising malpractice-insurance rates caused doctors at Crittenden County Hospital to stop delivering babies last year.
That forced the hospital to drop obstetrical services and Perryman to find a new doctor.
"I don't like it at all," she said about having to give birth in another county. She is a nurse at Crittenden County Hospital and its former obstetrics supervisor.
With Perryman's first two deliveries, "I knew everybody here in the hospital, and I was comfortable," she said. "And now I'm going somewhere where I don't know anybody or how anything's done."
Perryman's experience makes her a supporter of Senate Bill 1, aimed at lowering medical malpractice rates to keep doctors from leaving Kentucky or from dropping risky specialties.



Comments
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Anonymous
The closure of OB services in rural areas is due to more than rising malpractice insurance rates. Too simplistic.
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Anonymous
I dont get it.
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Anonymous
"Additionally it's reported that matching for OB/Gyn residency slots is dramatically down the past 4 years. Thus a declining replacement pool for rural areas."
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storkdoc
Well I practice OB at the hospital in Madisonville, and this has been happening alot. Since the reimbursement rates are lower in KY ( about $900 for a KY medicaid delivery vs about $1700 when I practiced in MA), but the malpractice is almost as high (About 85K/yr in Ky, about 110k/yr in MA,) you need to deliver many babies to recoup the cost.
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Bob Vineyard, CLU
Storkdoc -
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Anonymous
In response to Anonymous 7:52 PM, its not as simple as just hiring midwives. Most, if not all certified midwives who deliver in hospital require back-up by an OB. Many hospitals who would hire midwives as employees would also need to hire an OB. For many, it's just not worth it.
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Anonymous
"Its similar to me trying to find an electrical engineer to hook up my stereo system. You dont need an electrical engineer for something that trivial"
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Greedy Trial Lawyer
This is what the Senate Bill intends to do to solve the problem being addressed: Its approval could lead to a $250,000 cap on jury awards for pain and suffering in medical malpractice lawsuits, which advocates say would help hold down doctors' premiums.
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Anonymous
It is not stupid, it is just part of the problem. The major part is to change the way lawyers are paid in this country (looser to pay the lawyers). This way, the cost of any insurance (not only medical) will drop significantly and services will become more affordable.
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Dr Dork
The cap doesn't seem to affect payout for medical and other expenses. Which is really the priority.
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Anonymous
"The major part is to change the way lawyers are paid in this country (looser to pay the lawyers)."
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Anonymous
" Lawyers fighting it should be ashamed of themselves - they are putting their own bulging pockets before public health concerns."
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Anonymous
What's interesting about that article is that while it's all about insurance rates, it never talks about the insurer(s) in question, who it is, how it sets its rates, anything.
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Dr Dork
Anon 9.26am.
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storkdoc
55% of our deliveries in madisonville were KY medicaid last year. We did 1034 deliveries split between 5 docs and 2.5 midwives (lost one mifwife half way through the year)
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Anonymous
"The problem is all the money ending up in insurance company coffers, and lawyers pockets, and not helping those who really need it."
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Anonymous
"And how do you propose people who can't afford to pay a lawyer by the hour go about paying back the other side's fees?"
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Anonymous
Lawyer Insurance? Lawyer Insurance? They already have it. If you win, you win. If you lose, try again another time.
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Anonymous
Maybe we need to invent a "right" to sue and then force everyone to get insurance that pays for lawyer's fees. Employers would have to offer this as part of their compsation package.
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Anonymous
"I guess lawyers will have to charge less than 250$ hourly if they want to have clients. Maybe people should start taking some form of insurance for "lawyer coverage"."
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Dr Dork
"CJD"
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Anonymous
Forgive me for not spell checking.
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Anonymous
If you guys have your "clients" interest at so high a premium, how come so many of you sue them afterwards to get a larger percent of the kitty?
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Dr Dork
No fault compensation was proposed to the plaintiff lawyers association by occupational medicine specialists in NSW, along with other measures to remove the adversarial nature of workers compensation here. This system has been proven to have a deleterious effect on rehabilitation prospects.
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Anonymous
"If you guys have your "clients" interest at so high a premium, how come so many of you sue them afterwards to get a larger percent of the kitty?"
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Anonymous
"The plaintiff lawyers refused to consider this - their argument : "our goal is to get the most money for our clients, not necessarily thier best health outcome".
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Dr Dork
Our duty to the public at times overrides our individual patient responsibilities.
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Dr Dork
I have been open about my "bias". Anon - are you a lawyer, and what type of practice do you...uh...practice ?
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Anonymous
Yet you still give the patient the full benefit of your care.
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Dr Dork
I don't think it's pointless. Perhaps this is the direction the US needs to be heading ? Your current system is very inefficient.
Post a CommentThe complete picture includes an aging practitioner population, burnout, decreased third party payments, rising overhead costs (this is where rising insurance rates impact), pressure from credentialing organizations (JCAHO and ACOG), and perception of increased malpractice risk.
Additionally it's reported that matching for OB/Gyn residency slots is dramatically down the past 4 years. Thus a declining replacement pool for rural areas.
6:59 PM
If the hospital cant find doctors to deliver babies because of malpractice, why dont they just hire midwives?
You dont need a doc to deliver a baby unless you are a high risk pregnancy.
Its similar to me trying to find an electrical engineer to hook up my stereo system. You dont need an electrical engineer for something that trivial
7:52 PM
Uh, why is that Sherlock??
7:59 PM
In Crittenden county they don't have the volume. In Madisonville, we do because we're a larger hospital serving a larger population. We are a tertiary care center as we have a NICU. As for malpractice, I work for a foundation that is self insured. So it really is the malpractice that is killing the OB at the smaller hospitals.
Lastly the malpractice for our midwives is about 40k or so per year... so that too is expensve for small hospitals.
8:25 PM
Any guess what percent of deliveries are Medicaid in your hospital?
9:07 PM
9:38 PM
If it were similar, you could hire a lawyer and sue the electrical engineer if the stereo system he was "hooking up" was delivered malfunctioned. And then the electrical engineers would have to start charging $10,000 to hook up a stereo. Then they would need insurance. Eventually it would become economically unfeasible to hook up stereos, and there would be nobody left to do it. There, now it's just like OB-GYN.
11:16 PM
The medical malpractice rates are high. That is a given.
The solution is to put a cap on the compensation that can be received by persons who have successfully litigated a complicated medical malpractice claim all the way to a jury verdict which determined a breach of the standard of care occurred and the fair compensation for the particular losses and injury caused. That is stupid.
5:51 AM
7:21 AM
Just a quarter-million cap on these blowouts of "emotional distress" claims, perhaps ?
The problem is that patient care as a whole is suffering due to the current system. It needs to be changed. The proposed changes aren't ideal, but at least a step in the right direction. Lawyers fighting it should be ashamed of themselves - they are putting their own bulging pockets before public health concerns.
8:19 AM
So why buy insurance? And how do you propose people who can't afford to pay a lawyer by the hour go about paying back the other side's fees?
"This way, the cost of any insurance (not only medical) will drop significantly and services will become more affordable."
How much have the insurers agreed to drop it if this happens?
9:24 AM
If anyone needs to be ashamed, it's physicians. Not once have any of them made a serious proposal involving improving the quality of their services. Instead, they seek to reduce their premiums solely by saving their insurer money which they hope will then be passed down to them.
Or do you genuinely believe there is no room for improvement?
9:26 AM
The way the insurers have been able to frame this debate without themselves being a part of it is an impressive performance of public relations/marketing.
9:28 AM
I presume you are a lawyer - am I correct?
You're diverting from the point I raised. Is income for yourself more important than public health ?
I don't know about the US, but Downunder medical boards will investigate any complaint against a doc, this is done openly, includes non-medical members, and if someone is incompetent, they are dealth with..appropriately.
The problem is all the money ending up in insurance company coffers, and lawyers pockets, and not helping those who really need it. Docs in the US, even here, are simply leaving high risk specialties as a result of the spiralling malpractice premiums - irregardless of how good or bad they are. Hardly anyone is entering their training programs. The shortage will only worsen, the way things are. Even OB/GYNs here who have never been sued are having to cease practice in that field because of the malpractice premiums.
Patient care is suffering in the current system. Here and there. That is the priority, not the interest of lawyers, or of physicians, for that matter.
11:07 AM
In Crittenden, the rate is probably higher as it is poorer there.
12:57 PM
How do you propose compensating those who have been injured by malpractice without lawyers or insurers? Will the layman just take his case to the doctor and the doctor will right a check? Or checks, as his medical bills come in?
CJD
5:30 PM
I guess lawyers will have to charge less than 250$ hourly if they want to have clients. Maybe people should start taking some form of insurance for "lawyer coverage".
How do you propose my cash patients to pay for their office visit ? If that is their problem, their lawyer fee is also their problem.
11:57 PM
12:46 AM
However, because this is a right, lawyers could not turn away anyone who had a claim that might be valid - even if they were not going to get reimbursed. Also, lets force the lawyers to deal with multiple 3rd party payers that also have their own views on what is or is not the proper practice of law and also pays them less than their bill.
How may lawyers (or plumbers or electricians or pilots or...) would start doing something else then?
No patient anywhere should ever recieve substandard care; anyone who does and is harmed should be compensated. No question on that issue. How to make this a reality (not a lottery, not a witch hunt, and not a hopeless, difficult endevor for the deserving)? I have no idea, but I don't think the current system accomplishes the goal perfectly.
2:09 AM
There is. It's called prepaid legal. It's for sale in all 50 states. And many, if not most, lawyers do charge less than that.
"How do you propose my cash patients to pay for their office visit ? If that is their problem, their lawyer fee is also their problem."
With cash, or any alternative model you can think of. Why should everyone else's method of reimbursement be limited because you can't figure out how to make yours work?
You last two posters are mad because your reimbursement method is screwed up, but instead of trying to make it better, you want everyone else's to be screwed up. That doesn't make any sense. How does that help you? No one is arguing with you that the 3rd party payer system isn't working.
9:32 AM
It's write...not right.
Ever heard of no-fault compensation? It works well in New Zealand.
Incompetent docs...a very small minority...are struck off by the medical board. Patients get what they need. Lawyers take a lesser proportion.
Everyone agres it is a good system...except those few lawyers who place self-interest above societal good.
10:28 AM
You want to propose no-fault, then do so. Right now, though, that's not even a gleam in a legislator's eye.
Why you think the lawyer should have society's interest at the forefront instead of their client's is beyond me. Do you as a doctor have society's interests at heart when you treat a patient, or that patient's?
9:18 PM
1:00 AM
The plaintiff lawyers refused to consider this - their argument : "our goal is to get the most money for our clients, not necessarily thier best health outcome".
We are talking about the system as a whole, more than individual scenarios. Doctors have an obligation to public health as well - for instance in regards to notifiable diseases.
I, personally, am a big fan of no-fault compensation separated from disciplinary matters.
The current system just ain't working.
5:38 AM
How many lawyers have sued their clients?
And why is that any different than doctors suing their patients' health insurers to get more money? After all, that costs the patients more in the form of higher premiums? And nearly a million doctors were involved in that suit.
9:05 AM
We are talking about the system as a whole, more than individual scenarios. Doctors have an obligation to public health as well - for instance in regards to notifiable diseases."
It's not the job of lawyers to improve the quality of your services. Those lawyers are exactly right - they have a duty to their client first and foremost. Your duty to your patient trumps any other duty you may have I would think, doesn't it?
Does New Zealand (which is where I presume you are) have universal health care?
9:07 AM
Example 1- notifiable disease eg schistomosiasis
Example 2- patient is psychotic with plan and means to kill certain person, needs immediate committal
I am not in NZ. But, as far as I am aware, it has universal healthcare.
9:51 AM
9:53 AM
How is it in a client or society's best interest not to file a case so an insurer saves a little money which they may or not pass on to their policyholders?
By the way, on your second example, situations like that are the only time when we're allowed to breach attorney-client privilege. When we know a crime will be committed if we don't speak.
Yours is not a bias, so much as it is your background. And yes, I'm a lawyer, but not a med mal lawyer. I do handle personal injury claims and have a general small town practice.
Including the experience of nations with universal health care in this debate is pointless, because there is simply not the need to recover money to pay for your future or past medical care.
10:28 AM
9:44 AM