Skip to content
  • About
  • Contact
  • Contribute
  • Book
  • Careers
  • Podcast
  • Recommended
  • Speaking
  • All
  • Physician
  • Practice
  • Policy
  • Finance
  • Conditions
  • .edu
  • Patient
  • Meds
  • Tech
  • Social
  • Video
    • All
    • Physician
    • Practice
    • Policy
    • Finance
    • Conditions
    • .edu
    • Patient
    • Meds
    • Tech
    • Social
    • Video
    • About
    • Contact
    • Contribute
    • Book
    • Careers
    • Podcast
    • Recommended
    • Speaking

Advice for a second year medical student

Skeptical Scalpel, MD
Education
October 16, 2010
39 Shares
Share
Tweet
Share

A rising second year medical student read some of my posts and wrote me a kind note asking if I would write something for students. I taught students and ran surgical clerkships at community teaching hospitals for my entire career until about 19 months ago.

I also was prompted to address this subject after reading a recent New York Times story about a new admissions policy at Mt. Sinai Medical School.

The school is accepting some students who are majoring in the humanities and are not required to take the usual science courses or the MCAT. In the words of one of the participants in the program: “I didn’t want to waste a class on physics, or waste a class on orgo [organic chemistry]. The social determinants of health are so much more pervasive than the immediate biology of it.” I agree that possibly “orgo” and probably physics are not necessarily essential for medical school applicants. But I think these courses are still relevant because they assess one’s ability to think.

According to the article, these humanities students are faring as well as traditional students as far as grades and class rankings are concerned. Is this because science doesn’t really matter or could there be another reason?

Grades in medical schools are a joke. Let’s talk about the third year. If you look at the explanation of grades that comes with a student’s medical school transcript, you will find that the average distribution of grades in third-year clerkships in all subjects is something like this: honors 30%; pass 68%; low pass 2%. It is almost impossible to flunk out of any medical school in the United States. I once received an application for residency from a student who had been matriculating at a single medical school for TEN YEARS! I assure you that dean’s letter was a masterpiece. [More on deans’ letters below] And the fourth year of medical school is even worse. With few exceptions, most schools allow students to choose electives which may be taken just about anywhere on the planet. There are no objective measures of performance on electives and students are even more likely to receive honors grades in electives than in required courses.

“‘When I use a word,’ Humpty Dumpty said, in a rather scornful tone, ‘it means just what I choose it to mean—neither more nor less.’” [Lewis Carroll, Through the Looking-Glass. See also Bill Clinton “It depends on what the meaning of the words ‘is’ is.” And “It depends on how you define alone…”]

Carroll’s quotation is not only applicable to Humpty Dumpty but it also describes most deans’ letters supporting student applications to residency training programs. Obfuscation is the name of the game. Until just a few years ago, deans did not even have to mention such things as failing a course, dropping out of school for a year or disciplinary actions. The letters all continue to read like public relations releases. The best part is the end where the dean uses an adjective, which in many instances is a code that tells the reader what the student’s class rank is, to describe the student. Some of my favorites from real dean’s letters are as follows [highest to lowest and, where indicated, % of the class receiving that adjective]:

School A—outstanding, excellent, superior, very good, good;
School B— superior 20%, outstanding 20%, excellent 30%, very good 20%, good 7%, solid 3% [I guess “solid” could mean the student is dense as a rock.];
School C—superior “a few,” outstanding 25%, excellent 65%, very good 20%. I know it doesn’t add up to 100% so talk to the dean. Also, the worst student in the class was very good.

Yes, medical school resembles that famous fictional town in the Midwest. “Welcome to Lake Wobegon, where all the women are strong, all the men are good-looking, and all the children are above average.” [Garrison Keillor]

As far as I know, most medical schools are teaching surgery just like they did 40 years ago. What is Hesselbach’s triangle? What is Charcot’s triad? Second assist on a bunch of cases. Get the lab results from the computer so they can be re-entered in the computer in a progress note. And so on. Now that an entire surgical textbook can be carried in your cell phone, why don’t we change the paradigm? Rather than forcing you to memorize information, we should be teaching you how analyze and synthesize it as it relates to your patient.

The third-year surgery rotation in medical school is not a necessarily a good simulation of what it’s like to be a surgical resident. I can’t say what goes on in every school, but the last school I was affiliated with allowed students to take off the day after call. I never could figure out why since we only woke them for major cases at night and they usually slept most of the time. All I could say was, “It’s your tuition [$45K/year] and if you want to go home, it’s OK with me.” By the way, we at the affiliated hospitals never saw a penny of that tuition money. I’m not sure exactly where it was spent. I think that the way students are coddled on surgery rotations might be a factor resulting in the high attrition rate [about 25%] of surgery residents; i.e., it looks easy from the perspective of a student who does not do much.

Fourth year is out of control. In addition to the grade problem mentioned above, students are permitted to choose just about any rotation they want in the fourth year. This leads to tragic situations such as the student who takes four or five orthopedic electives in order to get noticed and then does not secure an orthopedic residency in the match. He will have wasted a good part of his fourth year.

One of the many unintended consequences of the electronic medical record [EMR] is the demise of medical student progress notes and orders. There is no provision for such activities in most EMRs. I have no idea how students are learning how to do these things.

My advice to my new friend, the rising second-year student, is that you should work hard and study hard during your surgery rotation in the third year. Be inquisitive. Be skeptical. Ask why. In my 38 years or so of teaching students, I estimate that I was challenged by a student on something I said fewer than five times. [Disclaimer #1: Not all authority figures like to be challenged. Choose your targets wisely. Be respectful.]

If you want to be a general surgeon, take one surgery elective in the fourth year just to be sure you are making the right choice. Then take electives in gastroenterology, critical care, radiology [Not just because of the hours. You will need to know how to read a CT scan in the middle of the night unless you want to wait a couple of hours for the nighthawk to fax a reading.], anesthesiology and other non-surgical rotations. [Disclaimer #2: This is my opinion and it may not be shared by others.]

Skeptical Scalpel is a surgeon blogs at his self-titled site, Skeptical Scalpel.

Submit a guest post and be heard.

Prev

How a tyranny of health is bad for both patients and physicians

October 16, 2010 Kevin 21
…
Next

10 top medical blog posts, September 2010

October 17, 2010 Kevin 0
…

Tagged as: Medical school, Surgery

Post navigation

< Previous Post
How a tyranny of health is bad for both patients and physicians
Next Post >
10 top medical blog posts, September 2010

More by Skeptical Scalpel, MD

  • The hospital CEO who made a surgical incision. What happened?

    Skeptical Scalpel, MD
  • Medical error is not the third leading cause of death

    Skeptical Scalpel, MD
  • Should speed-eating contests be banned?

    Skeptical Scalpel, MD

More in Education

  • The secret to success in medical school: self-awareness and courage

    Kaelor Gordon
  • Is mandating pre-medical training widening disparities in the U.S. physician workforce?

    Deepak Gupta, MD and Sarwan Kumar, MD
  • Equalizing the future of medical residencies: standardizing work hours and wages

    Deepak Gupta, MD and Sarwan Kumar, MD
  • From studying to baby kicks: Navigating motherhood in medical school

    Natalie Eichner-Seitz
  • The power of advocacy: a medical student’s journey to helping an uninsured immigrant

    Fabiola Plaza
  • From AI to love: the key to a better future in medical education

    Stevan Walkowski, DO
  • Most Popular

  • Past Week

    • The real cause of America’s opioid crisis: Doctors are not to blame

      Richard A. Lawhern, PhD | Meds
    • Healing the damaged nurse-physician dynamic

      Angel J. Mena, MD and Ali Morin, MSN, RN | Policy
    • The struggle to fill emergency medicine residency spots: Exploring the factors behind the unfilled match

      Katrina Gipson, MD, MPH | Physician
    • What is driving physicians to the edge of despair?

      Edward T. Creagan, MD | Physician
    • Deaths of despair: an urgent call for a collective response to the crisis in U.S. life expectancy

      Mohammed Umer Waris, MD | Policy
    • Beyond the disease: the power of empathy in health care

      Nana Dadzie Ghansah, MD | Physician
  • Past 6 Months

    • The hidden dangers of the Nebraska Heartbeat Act

      Meghan Sheehan, MD | Policy
    • The real cause of America’s opioid crisis: Doctors are not to blame

      Richard A. Lawhern, PhD | Meds
    • The vital importance of climate change education in medical schools

      Helen Kim, MD | Policy
    • The fight for reproductive health: Why medication abortion matters

      Catherine Hennessey, MD | Physician
    • Nobody wants this job. Should physicians stick around?

      Katie Klingberg, MD | Physician
    • Resetting the doctor-patient relationship: Navigating the challenges of modern primary care

      Jeffrey H. Millstein, MD | Physician
  • Recent Posts

    • The harmful effects of shaming patients for self-education

      Maryanna Barrett, MD | Physician
    • The power of self-appreciation: Why physicians need to start acknowledging their own contributions

      Wendy Schofer, MD | Physician
    • The endless waves of chronic illness

      Michele Luckenbaugh | Conditions
    • Skydiving and surgery: How one doctor translates high-stress training to saving lives

      Alexandra Kharazi, MD | Physician
    • Telemedicine in the opioid crisis: a game-changer threatened by DEA regulations

      Julie Craig, MD | Meds
    • How this doctor found her passion in ballroom dancing [PODCAST]

      The Podcast by KevinMD | Podcast

Subscribe to KevinMD and never miss a story!

Get free updates delivered free to your inbox.


Find jobs at
Careers by KevinMD.com

Search thousands of physician, PA, NP, and CRNA jobs now.

Learn more

View 17 Comments >

Founded in 2004 by Kevin Pho, MD, KevinMD.com is the web’s leading platform where physicians, advanced practitioners, nurses, medical students, and patients share their insight and tell their stories.

Social

  • Like on Facebook
  • Follow on Twitter
  • Connect on Linkedin
  • Subscribe on Youtube
  • Instagram

CME Spotlights

From MedPage Today

Latest News

  • Children Do Well With Fewer Opiates After Surgery
  • High Out-of-Pocket Costs Tied to Less Follow-Up After Initial Mammography
  • Do We Need a Spring COVID-19 Booster?
  • Advances in Diagnosis and Management of Severe Cutaneous Adverse Reactions
  • Are We Losing the Personal Touch Because of the Way We Staff?

Meeting Coverage

  • Children Do Well With Fewer Opiates After Surgery
  • Advances in Diagnosis and Management of Severe Cutaneous Adverse Reactions
  • Orismilast Clears Skin in Moderate-to-Severe Psoriasis
  • New Combinations Promising in Advanced Urothelial Carcinoma
  • No Survival Benefit With CRT Versus Chemo for Locally Advanced Endometrial Cancer
  • Most Popular

  • Past Week

    • The real cause of America’s opioid crisis: Doctors are not to blame

      Richard A. Lawhern, PhD | Meds
    • Healing the damaged nurse-physician dynamic

      Angel J. Mena, MD and Ali Morin, MSN, RN | Policy
    • The struggle to fill emergency medicine residency spots: Exploring the factors behind the unfilled match

      Katrina Gipson, MD, MPH | Physician
    • What is driving physicians to the edge of despair?

      Edward T. Creagan, MD | Physician
    • Deaths of despair: an urgent call for a collective response to the crisis in U.S. life expectancy

      Mohammed Umer Waris, MD | Policy
    • Beyond the disease: the power of empathy in health care

      Nana Dadzie Ghansah, MD | Physician
  • Past 6 Months

    • The hidden dangers of the Nebraska Heartbeat Act

      Meghan Sheehan, MD | Policy
    • The real cause of America’s opioid crisis: Doctors are not to blame

      Richard A. Lawhern, PhD | Meds
    • The vital importance of climate change education in medical schools

      Helen Kim, MD | Policy
    • The fight for reproductive health: Why medication abortion matters

      Catherine Hennessey, MD | Physician
    • Nobody wants this job. Should physicians stick around?

      Katie Klingberg, MD | Physician
    • Resetting the doctor-patient relationship: Navigating the challenges of modern primary care

      Jeffrey H. Millstein, MD | Physician
  • Recent Posts

    • The harmful effects of shaming patients for self-education

      Maryanna Barrett, MD | Physician
    • The power of self-appreciation: Why physicians need to start acknowledging their own contributions

      Wendy Schofer, MD | Physician
    • The endless waves of chronic illness

      Michele Luckenbaugh | Conditions
    • Skydiving and surgery: How one doctor translates high-stress training to saving lives

      Alexandra Kharazi, MD | Physician
    • Telemedicine in the opioid crisis: a game-changer threatened by DEA regulations

      Julie Craig, MD | Meds
    • How this doctor found her passion in ballroom dancing [PODCAST]

      The Podcast by KevinMD | Podcast

MedPage Today Professional

An Everyday Health Property Medpage Today iMedicalApps
  • Terms of Use | Disclaimer
  • Privacy Policy
  • DMCA Policy
All Content © KevinMD, LLC
Site by Outthink Group

Advice for a second year medical student
17 comments

Comments are moderated before they are published. Please read the comment policy.

Loading Comments...