<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0" xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/" xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/" xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom" xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/" > <channel><title>Comments on: Christian Science prayer should not be a part of health reform</title> <atom:link href="http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/11/christian-science-prayer-part-health-reform.html/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" /><link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/11/christian-science-prayer-part-health-reform.html</link> <description></description> <lastBuildDate>Wed, 15 Feb 2012 00:27:00 +0000</lastBuildDate> <sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod> <sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency> <xhtml:meta xmlns:xhtml="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml" name="robots" content="noindex" /> <item><title>By: Betty</title><link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/11/christian-science-prayer-part-health-reform.html#comment-117491</link> <dc:creator>Betty</dc:creator> <pubDate>Sat, 07 Nov 2009 20:06:32 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/?p=41122#comment-117491</guid> <description>I don&#039;t want to let too much time to pass before commenting again.  Kevin has moved on to other issues, and the people who follow him are moving along as well.  More needs to be said about this topic, however, and I humbly ask that members of the medical profession take note with regard to my thoughts about the practice of certain spiritual healing attempts.  Please forgive the obvious bias revealed in my previous comment.  I&#039;m sure you understand, but even so, it isn&#039;t acceptable.First, in brief, if Stephen Barrett M.D. is correct, Sen. Hatch has been involved legislatively on behalf of Christian Science before.  If the reader is interested, please see the section &quot;Undeserved Political Privilege&quot; found on the following link to the page, &quot;The Origin and Current Status of Christian Science.&quot;http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/cs2.htmlI think that&#039;s interesting; however, I believe that Christian Science is a red herring in this current instance.  It is true that CS practitioners and CS nurse practitioners may benefit financially should this legislation pass as stands, but it&#039;s being dragged through the public mud sufficiently to make me suspicious.With regard to the practice of certain spiritual healing principles, I would ask the medical professional to consider this:  What do you think of the activity of one person telling another person in physical pain that the pain is unreal?  Is that not, in other circumstances, considered a form of psychological abuse popularly known as &quot;gas lighting?&quot;Think of the child in physical pain being told such a thing.  &quot;Your pain is not real.&quot;  Moreover, not only is the child being told that his or her pain is not real, but it is being said by someone with a &lt;i&gt;calm countenance&lt;/i&gt;, and with complete power over the child.  How is that not gas lighting in one of its most extreme forms?Thus, I am not thinking exclusively about children who happen to die as a result of medical neglect, but of the psychological health of &lt;i&gt;every&lt;/i&gt; child raised in that kind of environment.  At least, with forms of religion involving big wooden masks and bone rattles, the child&#039;s pain is acknowledged.  I can&#039;t endorse such practices, but -- if nothing else -- the child is validated in some fashion and led to believe that something is being done.I have to walk away from this now.  To conclude, Kevin&#039;s blog has to do with the measure of the proposed legislation pertaining to spiritual healing. That is the focus, and must be considered, but I think there is more to weigh than the proposed legislation.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t want to let too much time to pass before commenting again.  Kevin has moved on to other issues, and the people who follow him are moving along as well.  More needs to be said about this topic, however, and I humbly ask that members of the medical profession take note with regard to my thoughts about the practice of certain spiritual healing attempts.  Please forgive the obvious bias revealed in my previous comment.  I&#8217;m sure you understand, but even so, it isn&#8217;t acceptable.</p><p>First, in brief, if Stephen Barrett M.D. is correct, Sen. Hatch has been involved legislatively on behalf of Christian Science before.  If the reader is interested, please see the section &#8220;Undeserved Political Privilege&#8221; found on the following link to the page, &#8220;The Origin and Current Status of Christian Science.&#8221;</p><p><a href="http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/cs2.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/cs2.html</a></p><p>I think that&#8217;s interesting; however, I believe that Christian Science is a red herring in this current instance.  It is true that CS practitioners and CS nurse practitioners may benefit financially should this legislation pass as stands, but it&#8217;s being dragged through the public mud sufficiently to make me suspicious.</p><p>With regard to the practice of certain spiritual healing principles, I would ask the medical professional to consider this:  What do you think of the activity of one person telling another person in physical pain that the pain is unreal?  Is that not, in other circumstances, considered a form of psychological abuse popularly known as &#8220;gas lighting?&#8221;</p><p>Think of the child in physical pain being told such a thing.  &#8220;Your pain is not real.&#8221;  Moreover, not only is the child being told that his or her pain is not real, but it is being said by someone with a <i>calm countenance</i>, and with complete power over the child.  How is that not gas lighting in one of its most extreme forms?</p><p>Thus, I am not thinking exclusively about children who happen to die as a result of medical neglect, but of the psychological health of <i>every</i> child raised in that kind of environment.  At least, with forms of religion involving big wooden masks and bone rattles, the child&#8217;s pain is acknowledged.  I can&#8217;t endorse such practices, but &#8212; if nothing else &#8212; the child is validated in some fashion and led to believe that something is being done.</p><p>I have to walk away from this now.  To conclude, Kevin&#8217;s blog has to do with the measure of the proposed legislation pertaining to spiritual healing. That is the focus, and must be considered, but I think there is more to weigh than the proposed legislation.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Nick</title><link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/11/christian-science-prayer-part-health-reform.html#comment-117453</link> <dc:creator>Nick</dc:creator> <pubDate>Sat, 07 Nov 2009 01:17:32 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/?p=41122#comment-117453</guid> <description>Radcs,The health care I use is being &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1109/29164.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;explicitly written out&lt;/a&gt;of the reform bills by religious people. I too, will be forced to buy health insurance which won&#039;t cover the majority of my costs. So yeah, tragic on the unfairness of the world and all, better luck in the next one, right?  It&#039;s completely inane that these religious types get to deny my health needs, women&#039;s reproductive choice needs,  and then turn around and get their witch doctoring covered. unbelievable.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Radcs,</p><p>The health care I use is being <a href="http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1109/29164.html" rel="nofollow">explicitly written out</a>of the reform bills by religious people. I too, will be forced to buy health insurance which won&#8217;t cover the majority of my costs. So yeah, tragic on the unfairness of the world and all, better luck in the next one, right?  It&#8217;s completely inane that these religious types get to deny my health needs, women&#8217;s reproductive choice needs,  and then turn around and get their witch doctoring covered. unbelievable.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Doc Stone</title><link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/11/christian-science-prayer-part-health-reform.html#comment-117218</link> <dc:creator>Doc Stone</dc:creator> <pubDate>Fri, 06 Nov 2009 01:35:37 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/?p=41122#comment-117218</guid> <description>radcsYou correctly point out that this overtly stupid idea is a logical outcome of mandating insurance---which is just yet another reason why mandating health insurance is an overtly stupid idea--at least for people who value freedom and autonomy and choice.If we must roll down the road to facism, a better choice for Christian Scientists than to be allowed to have their own place in the goosestepping legions would be to allowed to opt out.We see here the problem with a coercive &quot;universal&quot; anything in such a pluralistic country as America.  It will force both Christian Scientists and the real scientists to pay for that to which  they are fundamentally opposed.   The nations where socialism works are far more homogenous than this one.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>radcs</p><p>You correctly point out that this overtly stupid idea is a logical outcome of mandating insurance&#8212;which is just yet another reason why mandating health insurance is an overtly stupid idea&#8211;at least for people who value freedom and autonomy and choice.</p><p>If we must roll down the road to facism, a better choice for Christian Scientists than to be allowed to have their own place in the goosestepping legions would be to allowed to opt out.</p><p>We see here the problem with a coercive &#8220;universal&#8221; anything in such a pluralistic country as America.  It will force both Christian Scientists and the real scientists to pay for that to which  they are fundamentally opposed.   The nations where socialism works are far more homogenous than this one.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Betty</title><link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/11/christian-science-prayer-part-health-reform.html#comment-117211</link> <dc:creator>Betty</dc:creator> <pubDate>Fri, 06 Nov 2009 01:03:25 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/?p=41122#comment-117211</guid> <description>radcs, I appreciate this opportunity to point out that my Mother and sister would probably be alive today if not for Christian Science.I choose health care, not Christian Science.  .</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>radcs, I appreciate this opportunity to point out that my Mother and sister would probably be alive today if not for Christian Science.</p><p>I choose health care, not Christian Science.  .</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Evinx</title><link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/11/christian-science-prayer-part-health-reform.html#comment-117201</link> <dc:creator>Evinx</dc:creator> <pubDate>Thu, 05 Nov 2009 23:55:47 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/?p=41122#comment-117201</guid> <description>THIS is what one gets when govt gets more deeply involved. Govt means you are delegating healthcare to a politcal process and therefore, subject to special interest group pressures. THIS is the nature of govt beast.The problem is govt should not be in control of BOTH regulations/standards and payments. If football players were both umpires and players, what kind of sport would it be?We need complete separation from medical standards and regulation from the payment authorization process.I suspect when one reads the health bills, you will find all kinds of &quot;goodies&quot; buried by special interest groups. Don&#039;t be surprised and don&#039;t complain bcs if you ask for more govt involvement, you are implicitly asking for more special interest group lobbying.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>THIS is what one gets when govt gets more deeply involved. Govt means you are delegating healthcare to a politcal process and therefore, subject to special interest group pressures. THIS is the nature of govt beast.</p><p>The problem is govt should not be in control of BOTH regulations/standards and payments. If football players were both umpires and players, what kind of sport would it be?</p><p>We need complete separation from medical standards and regulation from the payment authorization process.</p><p>I suspect when one reads the health bills, you will find all kinds of &#8220;goodies&#8221; buried by special interest groups. Don&#8217;t be surprised and don&#8217;t complain bcs if you ask for more govt involvement, you are implicitly asking for more special interest group lobbying.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: radcs</title><link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/11/christian-science-prayer-part-health-reform.html#comment-117150</link> <dc:creator>radcs</dc:creator> <pubDate>Thu, 05 Nov 2009 18:09:56 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/?p=41122#comment-117150</guid> <description>I am a practicing Christian Scientist and my family has successfully relied on spiritual healing for five generations now.  My intent in posting this comment is not to “pitch” my preferred system of healing to those who depend on other types of health care, but to explain why I feel it is important that there be a provision for spiritual healing in any forthcoming healthcare legislation.It would seem fundamentally unfair for someone to be required to pay for insurance that does not cover the type of healthcare he or she utilizes.  In a policy climate where some form of mandated universal coverage appears likely, it would only seem fair that anyone required to pay into a system would have coverage for the type of health care that they have found works best for them (without depriving anyone else of their choices).  If the individual mandate to buy insurance does not provide for those who rely on qualifying spiritual care, they may receive no benefit for their premiums.I appreciate this opportunity to provide a different perspective on this issue. Anyone interested in learning more about Christian Science healing may wish to check out the website www.ChristianScience.com.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am a practicing Christian Scientist and my family has successfully relied on spiritual healing for five generations now.  My intent in posting this comment is not to “pitch” my preferred system of healing to those who depend on other types of health care, but to explain why I feel it is important that there be a provision for spiritual healing in any forthcoming healthcare legislation.</p><p>It would seem fundamentally unfair for someone to be required to pay for insurance that does not cover the type of healthcare he or she utilizes.  In a policy climate where some form of mandated universal coverage appears likely, it would only seem fair that anyone required to pay into a system would have coverage for the type of health care that they have found works best for them (without depriving anyone else of their choices).  If the individual mandate to buy insurance does not provide for those who rely on qualifying spiritual care, they may receive no benefit for their premiums.</p><p>I appreciate this opportunity to provide a different perspective on this issue. Anyone interested in learning more about Christian Science healing may wish to check out the website <a href="http://www.ChristianScience.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.ChristianScience.com</a>.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Blake</title><link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/11/christian-science-prayer-part-health-reform.html#comment-117137</link> <dc:creator>Blake</dc:creator> <pubDate>Thu, 05 Nov 2009 17:17:47 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/?p=41122#comment-117137</guid> <description>This is going to raise interesting questions of the role of any alternative practitioners and treatments in the public option.  If prayer is not supported because there is no scientific support making it any superior to placebo, then what about other treatments with a similar lack of support?  Reiki, homeopathy, etc?  Who decides what is valid and payable and what is not?  That isn&#039;t rhetorical... I&#039;d genuinely like to know.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is going to raise interesting questions of the role of any alternative practitioners and treatments in the public option.  If prayer is not supported because there is no scientific support making it any superior to placebo, then what about other treatments with a similar lack of support?  Reiki, homeopathy, etc?  Who decides what is valid and payable and what is not?  That isn&#8217;t rhetorical&#8230; I&#8217;d genuinely like to know.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: R Watkins</title><link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/11/christian-science-prayer-part-health-reform.html#comment-117125</link> <dc:creator>R Watkins</dc:creator> <pubDate>Thu, 05 Nov 2009 15:54:26 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/?p=41122#comment-117125</guid> <description>Why would a Christian Scientist have health insurance to begin with?  Seems like they would be saving thousands of dollars that they could use to reimburse prayer practitioners.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why would a Christian Scientist have health insurance to begin with?  Seems like they would be saving thousands of dollars that they could use to reimburse prayer practitioners.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Doc Stone</title><link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/11/christian-science-prayer-part-health-reform.html#comment-116884</link> <dc:creator>Doc Stone</dc:creator> <pubDate>Thu, 05 Nov 2009 00:15:00 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/?p=41122#comment-116884</guid> <description>Pay for prayer?  Sounds like a great business opportunity--as least as long as the current psychotic fools inhabit congress.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Pay for prayer?  Sounds like a great business opportunity&#8211;as least as long as the current psychotic fools inhabit congress.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: If you pay for prayer, you pay too much &#171; DUNCAN CROSS</title><link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/11/christian-science-prayer-part-health-reform.html#comment-116830</link> <dc:creator>If you pay for prayer, you pay too much &#171; DUNCAN CROSS</dc:creator> <pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 17:16:33 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/?p=41122#comment-116830</guid> <description>[...] Movin&#8217; Meat and Kevin, MD, comes this LA Times article about funding for &#8220;prayer healing&#8221;. Apparently the [...]</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Movin&#8217; Meat and Kevin, MD, comes this LA Times article about funding for &#8220;prayer healing&#8221;. Apparently the [...]</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> </channel> </rss>
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