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	<title>Comments on: Losing the anti-vaccine fight, and what we should do next</title>
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	<link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/06/losing-the-anti-vaccine-fight-and-what-we-should-do-next.html</link>
	<description>medical blog</description>
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		<title>By: Evita</title>
		<link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/06/losing-the-anti-vaccine-fight-and-what-we-should-do-next.html/comment-page-1#comment-113127</link>
		<dc:creator>Evita</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Oct 2009 15:42:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/?p=30235#comment-113127</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t believe that vaccines caused my son to be autistic.  There is so much research out there about vaccinations versus not getting them.  Not getting them is just plain ignorant.  Parents just want an answer to the reason why autism happens and they are grasping at straws.  Of course, I would like to know why and I would love a cure but I must face the here and now.  So many parents get lost in the why questions.  I say that it is not the vaccinations and even if it was, so what.  I choose to deal with one day at a time and to focus on making my son smile each day.  Smiling is something he can do, severely disabled or not.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t believe that vaccines caused my son to be autistic.  There is so much research out there about vaccinations versus not getting them.  Not getting them is just plain ignorant.  Parents just want an answer to the reason why autism happens and they are grasping at straws.  Of course, I would like to know why and I would love a cure but I must face the here and now.  So many parents get lost in the why questions.  I say that it is not the vaccinations and even if it was, so what.  I choose to deal with one day at a time and to focus on making my son smile each day.  Smiling is something he can do, severely disabled or not.</p>
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		<title>By: Melissa</title>
		<link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/06/losing-the-anti-vaccine-fight-and-what-we-should-do-next.html/comment-page-1#comment-92036</link>
		<dc:creator>Melissa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Jun 2009 22:20:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/?p=30235#comment-92036</guid>
		<description>&quot;And perhaps we should not be so quick to embrace every new vaccine that comes out. Let’s focus on what is already recommended.&quot;

As a mother I heartily agree with this.  My daughter (2.5) has had everything recommended by the CDC other than rotavirus.  It had just been reintroduced when she should have started it and the pediatrician we saw wasn&#039;t even stocking it.  I think the HepB, varicella and rotavirus vaccinations are questionable as far as actual need and danger of these diseases.  The simple truth is that if the medical establishment insists that we worry about every little thing the reality will be that we take things like measles, mumps, diphtheria much less seriously.  

All that said, I think the tide will turn when these hippy granola communities start seeing lots of kids with measles, mumps and pertussis.  I&#039;ve already seen one news story about a playgroup that asked and non-vaccinating mom to withdraw herself and her child.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;And perhaps we should not be so quick to embrace every new vaccine that comes out. Let’s focus on what is already recommended.&#8221;</p>
<p>As a mother I heartily agree with this.  My daughter (2.5) has had everything recommended by the CDC other than rotavirus.  It had just been reintroduced when she should have started it and the pediatrician we saw wasn&#8217;t even stocking it.  I think the HepB, varicella and rotavirus vaccinations are questionable as far as actual need and danger of these diseases.  The simple truth is that if the medical establishment insists that we worry about every little thing the reality will be that we take things like measles, mumps, diphtheria much less seriously.  </p>
<p>All that said, I think the tide will turn when these hippy granola communities start seeing lots of kids with measles, mumps and pertussis.  I&#8217;ve already seen one news story about a playgroup that asked and non-vaccinating mom to withdraw herself and her child.</p>
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		<title>By: Travel MD</title>
		<link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/06/losing-the-anti-vaccine-fight-and-what-we-should-do-next.html/comment-page-1#comment-92009</link>
		<dc:creator>Travel MD</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Jun 2009 16:20:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/?p=30235#comment-92009</guid>
		<description>Re: Dougherty, This is why patient choice must be protected: we might be wrong.  Often, changes come about, not because of our medical establishment, but because of patients who are LIVING the problem.  Also, along with FP, I think gardasil is the biggest joke.  What were doctors thinking when they hopped on this bandwagon?  We may be really smart and really educated, but modesty doesn&#039;t hurt either.  
We have TOO many vaccines and separating them into needed or advised could be a way to handle this, too.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Re: Dougherty, This is why patient choice must be protected: we might be wrong.  Often, changes come about, not because of our medical establishment, but because of patients who are LIVING the problem.  Also, along with FP, I think gardasil is the biggest joke.  What were doctors thinking when they hopped on this bandwagon?  We may be really smart and really educated, but modesty doesn&#8217;t hurt either.<br />
We have TOO many vaccines and separating them into needed or advised could be a way to handle this, too.</p>
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		<title>By: Dr_Mnemonic</title>
		<link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/06/losing-the-anti-vaccine-fight-and-what-we-should-do-next.html/comment-page-1#comment-92006</link>
		<dc:creator>Dr_Mnemonic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Jun 2009 15:55:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/?p=30235#comment-92006</guid>
		<description>As a physician (resident) with a son who is autistic, I have been on the front-line of this debate since his diagnosis in 2001 at age 2. 

Where are the people talking about how the original, FLAWED study making the link had an n=12 and the author of the study has actually been charged with professional misconduct for the way in which the study not only misinterpreted the autism results, but made claims to have found a new kind of IBD?

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/health/article5683671.ece

Oh wait... I always forget, facts don&#039;t matter when you are arguing against a pretty blonde and a billionaire who both live in a world where opinion is the ONLY thing of consequence.

I&#039;m sorry. I tell people to their face they are uninformed and misinformed about the vaccine risk if they believe there is a link between the two. 

To be fair, there MAY be a pre-disposition that is exacerbated with vaccines, but I doubt it. My son was a 31 weeker with low grade brain bleed at birth that healed. Until we start getting head CT&#039;s on all newborns (I&#039;m kidding) and tracking family history and all symptom cause --&gt; autism - we have NO IDEA what causes it, but I will bet my next board score it&#039;s not vaccines in and of themselves.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a physician (resident) with a son who is autistic, I have been on the front-line of this debate since his diagnosis in 2001 at age 2. </p>
<p>Where are the people talking about how the original, FLAWED study making the link had an n=12 and the author of the study has actually been charged with professional misconduct for the way in which the study not only misinterpreted the autism results, but made claims to have found a new kind of IBD?</p>
<p><a href="http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/health/article5683671.ece" rel="nofollow">http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/health/article5683671.ece</a></p>
<p>Oh wait&#8230; I always forget, facts don&#8217;t matter when you are arguing against a pretty blonde and a billionaire who both live in a world where opinion is the ONLY thing of consequence.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m sorry. I tell people to their face they are uninformed and misinformed about the vaccine risk if they believe there is a link between the two. </p>
<p>To be fair, there MAY be a pre-disposition that is exacerbated with vaccines, but I doubt it. My son was a 31 weeker with low grade brain bleed at birth that healed. Until we start getting head CT&#8217;s on all newborns (I&#8217;m kidding) and tracking family history and all symptom cause &#8211;&gt; autism &#8211; we have NO IDEA what causes it, but I will bet my next board score it&#8217;s not vaccines in and of themselves.</p>
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		<title>By: Harold L Doherty</title>
		<link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/06/losing-the-anti-vaccine-fight-and-what-we-should-do-next.html/comment-page-1#comment-91996</link>
		<dc:creator>Harold L Doherty</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Jun 2009 10:14:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/?p=30235#comment-91996</guid>
		<description>I am one of the &quot;undecided&quot; who does not share your perspective.  I am the father of a 13 year old severely autistic boy whose developmental issues were apparent long before he was diagnosed at age 2 and we never attributed his autistic disorder to vaccines.  

I also accepted the epidemiological studies as being conclusive on the issue of possible vaccine autism connections.  I no long do and I am now undecided.  One reason is the public positions tatken by Dr. Bernadine Healy who has said that the epidemiological studies are not specific enough to tell us anything about population subsets that might be vulnerable to vaccine induced injury.  Dr. Healy has also pointed out that the 2004 IOM report on vaccines and autism expressly discouraged research, including lab, biological and clinical studies that might have revealed more information about possible vaccine autism connections.  Her comments came several years after research Teresa Binstock complained that autism researchers were actively discouraged from exploring ANY possible environmental factors relating to autism including vaccines.

Dr. Healy&#039;s comments have been echoed to some extent by Dr. Julie Gerberding who has said that observational studies of autism rates amongst vaccinated and unvaccinated groups should be done.  Dr. Jon Poling, the neurologist, who successfully pursued a vaccine injury claim on behalf of his autistic daughter has also called for more research.

The Interagency Autism Coordinating Committee strategic research plan and the recent NVAC Committee recommendations both recommend autism vaccine research.

If you want people to believe the truth about vaccines and autism let the research be done and then let people assess these issues ... whatever the outcome.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am one of the &#8220;undecided&#8221; who does not share your perspective.  I am the father of a 13 year old severely autistic boy whose developmental issues were apparent long before he was diagnosed at age 2 and we never attributed his autistic disorder to vaccines.  </p>
<p>I also accepted the epidemiological studies as being conclusive on the issue of possible vaccine autism connections.  I no long do and I am now undecided.  One reason is the public positions tatken by Dr. Bernadine Healy who has said that the epidemiological studies are not specific enough to tell us anything about population subsets that might be vulnerable to vaccine induced injury.  Dr. Healy has also pointed out that the 2004 IOM report on vaccines and autism expressly discouraged research, including lab, biological and clinical studies that might have revealed more information about possible vaccine autism connections.  Her comments came several years after research Teresa Binstock complained that autism researchers were actively discouraged from exploring ANY possible environmental factors relating to autism including vaccines.</p>
<p>Dr. Healy&#8217;s comments have been echoed to some extent by Dr. Julie Gerberding who has said that observational studies of autism rates amongst vaccinated and unvaccinated groups should be done.  Dr. Jon Poling, the neurologist, who successfully pursued a vaccine injury claim on behalf of his autistic daughter has also called for more research.</p>
<p>The Interagency Autism Coordinating Committee strategic research plan and the recent NVAC Committee recommendations both recommend autism vaccine research.</p>
<p>If you want people to believe the truth about vaccines and autism let the research be done and then let people assess these issues &#8230; whatever the outcome.</p>
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		<title>By: MLO</title>
		<link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/06/losing-the-anti-vaccine-fight-and-what-we-should-do-next.html/comment-page-1#comment-91993</link>
		<dc:creator>MLO</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Jun 2009 08:02:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/?p=30235#comment-91993</guid>
		<description>I watch this fight from the purview of the history buff.  I look at it in the same way that people who demonize obstetrics go on and on about how home and unassisted birth are the greatest things  since sliced bread.

Are  there problems with vaccines?  Yes.

Do the benefits for most of the vaccines outweigh the problems?  Yes.

The simple fact of the matter is that people DIED from these diseases.  That&#039;s what parents of today who slept through any history class they had in high school - and I&#039;m including medical professionals.

Is every vaccines 100% necessary?  Probably not.  But, I will concede most are if we, as a species, wish to prevent pandemics for the things we can.

Maybe if physicians had books with pictures of actual victims of these diseases before vaccines were available littering their waiting rooms in the &quot;adult reading&quot; area people might be a bit less uneducated.  But, most folks don&#039;t like reality.

It does not help when everyone has become so entrenched in their view that they can&#039;t even listen to folks with legitimate concerns.  Questioning why the schedule is so aggressive is not questioning the legitimacy of the vaccines.  Too many physicians act as if that were the same thing.  It pushes some who were on the fence onto the anti-vaccines side.

I for one do not want to see a resurgence of the mumps, whooping cough, polio, or any other disease we have effective vaccines for!  I&#039;ve read the history and the death tolls.  It is true in every endeavor, those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I watch this fight from the purview of the history buff.  I look at it in the same way that people who demonize obstetrics go on and on about how home and unassisted birth are the greatest things  since sliced bread.</p>
<p>Are  there problems with vaccines?  Yes.</p>
<p>Do the benefits for most of the vaccines outweigh the problems?  Yes.</p>
<p>The simple fact of the matter is that people DIED from these diseases.  That&#8217;s what parents of today who slept through any history class they had in high school &#8211; and I&#8217;m including medical professionals.</p>
<p>Is every vaccines 100% necessary?  Probably not.  But, I will concede most are if we, as a species, wish to prevent pandemics for the things we can.</p>
<p>Maybe if physicians had books with pictures of actual victims of these diseases before vaccines were available littering their waiting rooms in the &#8220;adult reading&#8221; area people might be a bit less uneducated.  But, most folks don&#8217;t like reality.</p>
<p>It does not help when everyone has become so entrenched in their view that they can&#8217;t even listen to folks with legitimate concerns.  Questioning why the schedule is so aggressive is not questioning the legitimacy of the vaccines.  Too many physicians act as if that were the same thing.  It pushes some who were on the fence onto the anti-vaccines side.</p>
<p>I for one do not want to see a resurgence of the mumps, whooping cough, polio, or any other disease we have effective vaccines for!  I&#8217;ve read the history and the death tolls.  It is true in every endeavor, those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it!</p>
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		<title>By: Daily Digest for June 9th &#124; David Konig</title>
		<link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/06/losing-the-anti-vaccine-fight-and-what-we-should-do-next.html/comment-page-1#comment-91992</link>
		<dc:creator>Daily Digest for June 9th &#124; David Konig</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Jun 2009 05:18:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/?p=30235#comment-91992</guid>
		<description>[...] Losing the anti-vaccine fight, and what we should do next &#8212; 11:00am via Google [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Losing the anti-vaccine fight, and what we should do next &mdash; 11:00am via Google [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Marilyn Mann</title>
		<link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/06/losing-the-anti-vaccine-fight-and-what-we-should-do-next.html/comment-page-1#comment-91986</link>
		<dc:creator>Marilyn Mann</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Jun 2009 01:48:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/?p=30235#comment-91986</guid>
		<description>Kevin

With all due respect, I think your headline is a little unclear.  &quot;Losing the anti-vaccine fight&quot; makes it sound like you are anti-vaccine.

Best, Marilyn</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kevin</p>
<p>With all due respect, I think your headline is a little unclear.  &#8220;Losing the anti-vaccine fight&#8221; makes it sound like you are anti-vaccine.</p>
<p>Best, Marilyn</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/06/losing-the-anti-vaccine-fight-and-what-we-should-do-next.html/comment-page-1#comment-91976</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Jun 2009 22:09:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/?p=30235#comment-91976</guid>
		<description>Perhaps it may be even more important now as a member of the general population or a parent to get the available vaccines, since the growing number of people who refuse vaccines makes it more likely that you will be exposed to some disease that the vaccines would prevent.

Regarding being vaccinated as a &quot;social responsibility&quot; (or positive externality in economic terms), that might not be the best way to convince many people, who, for whatever reason, are more likely to see something as a conspiracy theory and actively go against something promoted as a &quot;social responsibility&quot;.  But the self-interest motivation in avoiding polio, measles, tetanus, etc. should be more than sufficient to induce people to get vaccinated.  Then again, it may take seeing someone in an iron lung to motivate people in this respect.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Perhaps it may be even more important now as a member of the general population or a parent to get the available vaccines, since the growing number of people who refuse vaccines makes it more likely that you will be exposed to some disease that the vaccines would prevent.</p>
<p>Regarding being vaccinated as a &#8220;social responsibility&#8221; (or positive externality in economic terms), that might not be the best way to convince many people, who, for whatever reason, are more likely to see something as a conspiracy theory and actively go against something promoted as a &#8220;social responsibility&#8221;.  But the self-interest motivation in avoiding polio, measles, tetanus, etc. should be more than sufficient to induce people to get vaccinated.  Then again, it may take seeing someone in an iron lung to motivate people in this respect.</p>
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		<title>By: family practitioner</title>
		<link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/06/losing-the-anti-vaccine-fight-and-what-we-should-do-next.html/comment-page-1#comment-91975</link>
		<dc:creator>family practitioner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Jun 2009 20:43:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/?p=30235#comment-91975</guid>
		<description>Isles:
I do not &quot;hate&quot; any of these vaccines.
My point was simple.  If I have explained to the best of my abilities why a vacccine is needed, and the parents still say no, for whatever reason, what is the point in arguing with them?

The zeal in your response sort of makes my point.  This is similar to a parent/child relationship in that the more we &quot;push&quot;, the more they &quot;resist.&quot;  Why don&#039;t we just give them the information, back off, and let the parents decide for themselves.  I can&#039;t force my patients to quit smoking, I can only recommend it.

You also need to understand that the &quot;business&quot; of vaccines is quite frustrating for those of us in private practice.  We know how to bill and do inventory quite well; that still does not stop 3rd party payors from paying less than the cost of the vaccine.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Isles:<br />
I do not &#8220;hate&#8221; any of these vaccines.<br />
My point was simple.  If I have explained to the best of my abilities why a vacccine is needed, and the parents still say no, for whatever reason, what is the point in arguing with them?</p>
<p>The zeal in your response sort of makes my point.  This is similar to a parent/child relationship in that the more we &#8220;push&#8221;, the more they &#8220;resist.&#8221;  Why don&#8217;t we just give them the information, back off, and let the parents decide for themselves.  I can&#8217;t force my patients to quit smoking, I can only recommend it.</p>
<p>You also need to understand that the &#8220;business&#8221; of vaccines is quite frustrating for those of us in private practice.  We know how to bill and do inventory quite well; that still does not stop 3rd party payors from paying less than the cost of the vaccine.</p>
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