Comments on: The profession with the highest suicide rate? http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2008/04/profession-with-highest-suicide-rate.html Tue, 14 Feb 2012 22:28:00 +0000 hourly 1 By: Anonhttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2008/04/profession-with-highest-suicide-rate.html#comment-114264 Anon Wed, 21 Oct 2009 01:10:04 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2008/04/the-profession-with-the-highest-suicide-rate.html#comment-114264 Those numbers are equivalent to police suicide rates as well. I don't think the main cause of suicide is ability, otherwise nuclear scientists and gunsmiths would be topping the lists. I think it has everything to do with people who take a role of responsibility where life/death and tragic life changing repercussions are at stake. All emergency personnel (fire, ems, police, er docs, etc.) are affected by the abnormal experiences that their job entails. Those numbers are equivalent to police suicide rates as well. I don’t think the main cause of suicide is ability, otherwise nuclear scientists and gunsmiths would be topping the lists. I think it has everything to do with people who take a role of responsibility where life/death and tragic life changing repercussions are at stake. All emergency personnel (fire, ems, police, er docs, etc.) are affected by the abnormal experiences that their job entails.

]]> By: Anonymoushttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2008/04/profession-with-highest-suicide-rate.html#comment-87027 Anonymous Mon, 11 Aug 2008 06:21:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2008/04/the-profession-with-the-highest-suicide-rate.html#comment-87027 The major variable in killing yourself is not how sad you are. It is simply your ability to do so. Doctor's have a high suicide rate because of their access to and knowledge of drugs that they can use to kill themselves. Law enforcement has a high suicide rate because they all have guns. <br/><br/>The reason men succeed in killing themseves more often is because they use guns which are effective. Women will use pills and fail. Female doctors, however, know exactly what they are doing so they can be as effective with a pill as a man is with a gun. The major variable in killing yourself is not how sad you are. It is simply your ability to do so. Doctor’s have a high suicide rate because of their access to and knowledge of drugs that they can use to kill themselves. Law enforcement has a high suicide rate because they all have guns.

The reason men succeed in killing themseves more often is because they use guns which are effective. Women will use pills and fail. Female doctors, however, know exactly what they are doing so they can be as effective with a pill as a man is with a gun.

]]> By: Duy Tranhttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2008/04/profession-with-highest-suicide-rate.html#comment-85184 Duy Tran Wed, 23 Apr 2008 01:35:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2008/04/the-profession-with-the-highest-suicide-rate.html#comment-85184 "Every year, between 300 and 400 physicians take their own lives..."<br/><br/>Is this in the USA or the world? “Every year, between 300 and 400 physicians take their own lives…”

Is this in the USA or the world?

]]> By: Anonymoushttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2008/04/profession-with-highest-suicide-rate.html#comment-85179 Anonymous Tue, 22 Apr 2008 23:08:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2008/04/the-profession-with-the-highest-suicide-rate.html#comment-85179 I did a review of this following a suicide in our facility. The article is quite shallow. That there is a higher rate than the general population is clear. The numbers conflict on whether it is higher than comparable demographic groups--while male professional with advanced degrees. Men have higher rates than women, white men higher than non-white, and more highly educated people than the less educated. <br/> <br/>I think that it is still higher for physicians. Some of the numbers for women doc are far more striking than those in the article.<br/><br/>Other liabilities are:<br/><br/>fewer failed attempts<br/><br/>no illusions about aging and disability and suffering<br/><br/>very high stress levels<br/><br/>1/3 get clinically depressed in internship--and depression doesn't "toughen us up"--it kindles later episodes of depression<br/><br/>chronic sleep deprivation<br/><br/>Probably the biggest are the cultural and legal barriers interfering with getting treatment. I did a review of this following a suicide in our facility. The article is quite shallow. That there is a higher rate than the general population is clear. The numbers conflict on whether it is higher than comparable demographic groups–while male professional with advanced degrees. Men have higher rates than women, white men higher than non-white, and more highly educated people than the less educated.

I think that it is still higher for physicians. Some of the numbers for women doc are far more striking than those in the article.

Other liabilities are:

fewer failed attempts

no illusions about aging and disability and suffering

very high stress levels

1/3 get clinically depressed in internship–and depression doesn’t “toughen us up”–it kindles later episodes of depression

chronic sleep deprivation

Probably the biggest are the cultural and legal barriers interfering with getting treatment.

]]> By: Anonymoushttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2008/04/profession-with-highest-suicide-rate.html#comment-85169 Anonymous Tue, 22 Apr 2008 18:30:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2008/04/the-profession-with-the-highest-suicide-rate.html#comment-85169 Interviewing for the medical school I ultimately attended, we were all subjected to the MMPI. I knew of the test from basic college psych, but I had never before actually seen and taken the test.<br/><br/>They had the questions about hearing voices, torturing animals, questions that would indicate significantly disturbed individuals if answered affirmatively.<br/><br/>As far as I know, it was not an admissions tool, but a faculty psychologist was studying MMPI profiles of medical students, those that apply, those accepted, how the different personality types did through school, etc......though not certain on this.<br/><br/>After admission, some time later, I asked the psychologist about the test. I figured the test would not be sensitive when applied to a population of medical students.<br/><br/>After all, anyone hearing voices, torturing animals, etc., would not make it as far as medical school. The person would have been weeded out long before admission, right?<br/><br/>She just smiled and said, "you'd be surprised".<br/><br/>I am no longer surprised. Interviewing for the medical school I ultimately attended, we were all subjected to the MMPI. I knew of the test from basic college psych, but I had never before actually seen and taken the test.

They had the questions about hearing voices, torturing animals, questions that would indicate significantly disturbed individuals if answered affirmatively.

As far as I know, it was not an admissions tool, but a faculty psychologist was studying MMPI profiles of medical students, those that apply, those accepted, how the different personality types did through school, etc……though not certain on this.

After admission, some time later, I asked the psychologist about the test. I figured the test would not be sensitive when applied to a population of medical students.

After all, anyone hearing voices, torturing animals, etc., would not make it as far as medical school. The person would have been weeded out long before admission, right?

She just smiled and said, “you’d be surprised”.

I am no longer surprised.

]]> By: Anonymoushttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2008/04/profession-with-highest-suicide-rate.html#comment-85164 Anonymous Tue, 22 Apr 2008 16:49:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2008/04/the-profession-with-the-highest-suicide-rate.html#comment-85164 My class in med school consisted of 8o students, two of whom committed suicide before graduation. That may seem like a high percentage, but both were deeply disturbed individuals, I am convinced (rhetrospectively) that both were manic-melancholic psychotics; or bipolar as it is now called. What puzzles me now, thirty years thereafter, is not that they killed themselves, but that they were admitted to medical school in the first place. Ought there not to be some crude psychological test to weed out not only the psychopaths who will endanger others, but also the psychotics who will endager themselves? My class in med school consisted of 8o students, two of whom committed suicide before graduation. That may seem like a high percentage, but both were deeply disturbed individuals, I am convinced (rhetrospectively) that both were manic-melancholic psychotics; or bipolar as it is now called. What puzzles me now, thirty years thereafter, is not that they killed themselves, but that they were admitted to medical school in the first place. Ought there not to be some crude psychological test to weed out not only the psychopaths who will endanger others, but also the psychotics who will endager themselves?

]]> By: Med Studenthttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2008/04/profession-with-highest-suicide-rate.html#comment-85156 Med Student Tue, 22 Apr 2008 07:26:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2008/04/the-profession-with-the-highest-suicide-rate.html#comment-85156 I would have thought it would be highest among med students. I would have thought it would be highest among med students.

]]> By: Anonymoushttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2008/04/profession-with-highest-suicide-rate.html#comment-85153 Anonymous Mon, 21 Apr 2008 23:03:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2008/04/the-profession-with-the-highest-suicide-rate.html#comment-85153 The MD is very poor protection against mental illness - we have just as much of it as the rest of the working population.<br/><br/>We just don't treat it and this attitude is tolerated well in our circles.<br/><br/>Besides, who has time to take care of ourselves? The MD is very poor protection against mental illness – we have just as much of it as the rest of the working population.

We just don’t treat it and this attitude is tolerated well in our circles.

Besides, who has time to take care of ourselves?

]]> By: amedicihttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2008/04/profession-with-highest-suicide-rate.html#comment-85149 amedici Mon, 21 Apr 2008 20:25:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2008/04/the-profession-with-the-highest-suicide-rate.html#comment-85149 The article you linked to stated that doctors are afraid to admit depression problems because they worry "that if they admit to a mental-health problem they could lose respect, referrals, income and even their licenses"<br/><br/>I don't understand. At present doctors who suffer from drug or alcohol addiction and are in rehab, are allowed to keep this secret and can continue treating their unaware patients with no fear of disclosure. So why aren't they allowed to keep their depression issues under wraps while being treated. The article you linked to stated that doctors are afraid to admit depression problems because they worry “that if they admit to a mental-health problem they could lose respect, referrals, income and even their licenses”

I don’t understand. At present doctors who suffer from drug or alcohol addiction and are in rehab, are allowed to keep this secret and can continue treating their unaware patients with no fear of disclosure. So why aren’t they allowed to keep their depression issues under wraps while being treated.

]]> By: Anonymoushttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2008/04/profession-with-highest-suicide-rate.html#comment-85148 Anonymous Mon, 21 Apr 2008 20:04:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2008/04/the-profession-with-the-highest-suicide-rate.html#comment-85148 Don't admit to having depression unless you have rock solid insurance. I was unable to obtain medical insurance for years because I made that mistake.<br/><br/>There is so much pressure on doctors. I don't know how they stand it. Don’t admit to having depression unless you have rock solid insurance. I was unable to obtain medical insurance for years because I made that mistake.

There is so much pressure on doctors. I don’t know how they stand it.

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