<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0" xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/" xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/" xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom" xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/" > <channel><title>Comments on: Arnold Kling, his father, and how Medicare is evil</title> <atom:link href="http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2008/01/arnold-kling-his-father-and-how.html/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" /><link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2008/01/arnold-kling-his-father-and-how.html</link> <description></description> <lastBuildDate>Tue, 14 Feb 2012 19:56:00 +0000</lastBuildDate> <sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod> <sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency> <xhtml:meta xmlns:xhtml="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml" name="robots" content="noindex" /> <item><title>By: Anonymous</title><link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2008/01/arnold-kling-his-father-and-how.html#comment-83205</link> <dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator> <pubDate>Thu, 31 Jan 2008 21:37:00 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2008/01/arnold-kling-his-father-and-how-medicare-is-evil.html#comment-83205</guid> <description>In response to Anonymous 9:51 pm: I could not have said it better myself!  Thank you.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Underpiad family practitioner in upstate New York</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In response to Anonymous 9:51 pm: I could not have said it better myself!  Thank you.</p><p>Underpiad family practitioner in upstate New York</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Samson Isberg</title><link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2008/01/arnold-kling-his-father-and-how.html#comment-83195</link> <dc:creator>Samson Isberg</dc:creator> <pubDate>Thu, 31 Jan 2008 06:35:00 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2008/01/arnold-kling-his-father-and-how-medicare-is-evil.html#comment-83195</guid> <description>Boston Blackie - if you pay for advice you have no intention of following - who&#039;s pretending to be smart here?</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Boston Blackie &#8211; if you pay for advice you have no intention of following &#8211; who&#8217;s pretending to be smart here?</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Boston Blackie</title><link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2008/01/arnold-kling-his-father-and-how.html#comment-83192</link> <dc:creator>Boston Blackie</dc:creator> <pubDate>Thu, 31 Jan 2008 03:31:00 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2008/01/arnold-kling-his-father-and-how-medicare-is-evil.html#comment-83192</guid> <description>I don&#039;t waste my internist&#039;s time at my yearly annual physical.  &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Get the blood work done, pick up my Rxs and get on my way.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;I end up doing what I want to anyway, but I don&#039;t tell Dr. F. this.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;  I pretend she&#039;s smart.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;That takes alot of pretending on my part.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t waste my internist&#8217;s time at my yearly annual physical.</p><p>Get the blood work done, pick up my Rxs and get on my way.</p><p>I end up doing what I want to anyway, but I don&#8217;t tell Dr. F. this.</p><p> I pretend she&#8217;s smart.</p><p>That takes alot of pretending on my part.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Anonymous</title><link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2008/01/arnold-kling-his-father-and-how.html#comment-83190</link> <dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator> <pubDate>Thu, 31 Jan 2008 02:51:00 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2008/01/arnold-kling-his-father-and-how-medicare-is-evil.html#comment-83190</guid> <description>This is a fine example of unintended consequences.  There are several reasons that there isn&#039;t an all encompassing doctor that follows you through all the stages of your care and understands the big picture:&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;1. The majority of people are more interested in the advice of a specialist.  This is an American malaise of always wanting the best thing.  &quot;Not only do I want to see an oncologist, I want to see the best melanoma oncologist in the country, that&#039;s why I came to see you,...&quot;&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;2. People veiw healthcare as a commodity, not as a luxury.  People buy insurance (the proxy for the price they pay for their doctors) by price, not by quality.  For those of you who get your insurance through your employer, remember, you have the option of buying it outside of your employer, or writing your congressman and asking them to change the tax incentives offerred to business for medical care.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;3. Most people are takers, not givers.  If someone sees that they have the opportunity to speak to a caring person about a problem, not only will they talk to them about the 2-3 most important things, but they will continue to talk and completely dilute the crux of their problem.  Most people are like dogs who are left with a bag of dog food while their owners are away.  They&#039;ll eat the entire thing at the first sitting.  If asked to &quot;name the thing that is bothering you the most&quot;, people become upset as they feel they have already prepaid for their doctors time. Patient caring doctors are abused because of their altruism.  (and as a result are paid less as a reward for their kindness)&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;4. The government and medical oligarchy has made up a system where doctors who deal with only one problem are paid MORE than doctors who deal with the big picture.  Why would physician&#039;s not follow financial incentives like everyone else.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;5. Physician&#039;s are paid by the &quot;piece&quot;, not by the hour.  If you are paid by the piece, you hurry.  If you are paid by the hour, you linger.  (notice your waiter and the highway repairmen if you doubt me)&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;6. Hospital&#039;s cater to supersubspecialists, often luring them with signing bonuses, subsidized rents, etc.  The flip side is that up until recently, hospitals viewed PCPs as business referrals and little else.  &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;So let&#039;s recap what we&#039;ve learned about the person who is willing to look at the big picture and take care of the whole patient:&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;1. They aren&#039;t valued by the patient &lt;br/&gt;2. They aren&#039;t valued by the government&lt;br/&gt;3. They aren&#039;t valued by the medical establishment&lt;br/&gt;4. They aren&#039;t valued by the hospital&lt;br/&gt;5. They make less than everyone else&lt;br/&gt;6. They are expected to be the quarterback for all of the patient&#039;s problems and if something is missed as with Mr. Kling, it is the fault of the big picture guy&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Who would want this job?  No one.  Anyone who isn&#039;t a complete martyr spends one year doing this and either becomes an alcoholic or changes their job.  What is crazy is that things are getting worse for this kind of doctor and no one who can change things cares.  &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;I would like a free lunch.  Delivered everyday with alacrity by  the most intelligent hardworking segment of our society.  But there is no such thing as a free lunch. Either for me or anyone else as long as people continue to have the freedom to choose how they make money and spend their work years. &lt;br/&gt;b</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is a fine example of unintended consequences.  There are several reasons that there isn&#8217;t an all encompassing doctor that follows you through all the stages of your care and understands the big picture:</p><p>1. The majority of people are more interested in the advice of a specialist.  This is an American malaise of always wanting the best thing.  &#8220;Not only do I want to see an oncologist, I want to see the best melanoma oncologist in the country, that&#8217;s why I came to see you,&#8230;&#8221;</p><p>2. People veiw healthcare as a commodity, not as a luxury.  People buy insurance (the proxy for the price they pay for their doctors) by price, not by quality.  For those of you who get your insurance through your employer, remember, you have the option of buying it outside of your employer, or writing your congressman and asking them to change the tax incentives offerred to business for medical care.</p><p>3. Most people are takers, not givers.  If someone sees that they have the opportunity to speak to a caring person about a problem, not only will they talk to them about the 2-3 most important things, but they will continue to talk and completely dilute the crux of their problem.  Most people are like dogs who are left with a bag of dog food while their owners are away.  They&#8217;ll eat the entire thing at the first sitting.  If asked to &#8220;name the thing that is bothering you the most&#8221;, people become upset as they feel they have already prepaid for their doctors time. Patient caring doctors are abused because of their altruism.  (and as a result are paid less as a reward for their kindness)</p><p>4. The government and medical oligarchy has made up a system where doctors who deal with only one problem are paid MORE than doctors who deal with the big picture.  Why would physician&#8217;s not follow financial incentives like everyone else.</p><p>5. Physician&#8217;s are paid by the &#8220;piece&#8221;, not by the hour.  If you are paid by the piece, you hurry.  If you are paid by the hour, you linger.  (notice your waiter and the highway repairmen if you doubt me)</p><p>6. Hospital&#8217;s cater to supersubspecialists, often luring them with signing bonuses, subsidized rents, etc.  The flip side is that up until recently, hospitals viewed PCPs as business referrals and little else.</p><p>So let&#8217;s recap what we&#8217;ve learned about the person who is willing to look at the big picture and take care of the whole patient:</p><p>1. They aren&#8217;t valued by the patient <br />2. They aren&#8217;t valued by the government<br />3. They aren&#8217;t valued by the medical establishment<br />4. They aren&#8217;t valued by the hospital<br />5. They make less than everyone else<br />6. They are expected to be the quarterback for all of the patient&#8217;s problems and if something is missed as with Mr. Kling, it is the fault of the big picture guy</p><p>Who would want this job?  No one.  Anyone who isn&#8217;t a complete martyr spends one year doing this and either becomes an alcoholic or changes their job.  What is crazy is that things are getting worse for this kind of doctor and no one who can change things cares.</p><p>I would like a free lunch.  Delivered everyday with alacrity by  the most intelligent hardworking segment of our society.  But there is no such thing as a free lunch. Either for me or anyone else as long as people continue to have the freedom to choose how they make money and spend their work years. <br />b</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Anonymous</title><link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2008/01/arnold-kling-his-father-and-how.html#comment-83189</link> <dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator> <pubDate>Thu, 31 Jan 2008 02:41:00 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2008/01/arnold-kling-his-father-and-how-medicare-is-evil.html#comment-83189</guid> <description>Kling moans about how little &quot;hands-on&quot; care his father received and disparages the specialists for specializing (of all things), yet in the same piece recites the instances of specialty care that have made his father able to live as long as he did. (And ironically, the one non-specialst attending Mr. Kling, the elder, has the pleasure of hearing Dr. Kling&#039;s Monday morning quarterbacking about the necessity of an x-ray for evaluation of cellulitis of the foot. Dr. Kling should take up podiatry, if he thinks himself so qualified.)&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;And somehow he says the reason for this is because of Medicare, and specifically because Medicare is pure &quot;evil.&quot; How that has anything to do with evaluating cellulitis has me guessing. Does he imagine that if Medicare paid more for a visit, the x-ray would not have been thought necessary? Interesting, but not convincing. But what do I know, I&#039;m just a specialist.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kling moans about how little &#8220;hands-on&#8221; care his father received and disparages the specialists for specializing (of all things), yet in the same piece recites the instances of specialty care that have made his father able to live as long as he did. (And ironically, the one non-specialst attending Mr. Kling, the elder, has the pleasure of hearing Dr. Kling&#8217;s Monday morning quarterbacking about the necessity of an x-ray for evaluation of cellulitis of the foot. Dr. Kling should take up podiatry, if he thinks himself so qualified.)</p><p>And somehow he says the reason for this is because of Medicare, and specifically because Medicare is pure &#8220;evil.&#8221; How that has anything to do with evaluating cellulitis has me guessing. Does he imagine that if Medicare paid more for a visit, the x-ray would not have been thought necessary? Interesting, but not convincing. But what do I know, I&#8217;m just a specialist.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Anonymous</title><link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2008/01/arnold-kling-his-father-and-how.html#comment-83185</link> <dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator> <pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2008/01/arnold-kling-his-father-and-how-medicare-is-evil.html#comment-83185</guid> <description>If the internist or family physician took the time on an elderly patient to address every  concern thoroughly during hospital rounding or clinic visits, he/she would be able to see about 50% of the patients currently being seen.  &lt;br/&gt;   Most of us in medicine would agree that would lead to better care, happier doctors, and happier patients.  &lt;br/&gt;BUT NO ONE WANTS TO PAY FOR THAT KIND OF CARE.  &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;So you get what you get.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If the internist or family physician took the time on an elderly patient to address every  concern thoroughly during hospital rounding or clinic visits, he/she would be able to see about 50% of the patients currently being seen. <br /> Most of us in medicine would agree that would lead to better care, happier doctors, and happier patients. <br />BUT NO ONE WANTS TO PAY FOR THAT KIND OF CARE.</p><p>So you get what you get.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Anonymous</title><link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2008/01/arnold-kling-his-father-and-how.html#comment-83182</link> <dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator> <pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 21:39:00 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2008/01/arnold-kling-his-father-and-how-medicare-is-evil.html#comment-83182</guid> <description>I agree totally Ed and rude awakening is coming.  I had to call in a favor to a PCP that I rotated with as a student for him to see my grandmother, because every other practice in town was closed to new medicare.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;In other news can we get a Celebration thread for John Edwards dropping out, Kevin.  I&#039;m as giddy as a little school girl.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree totally Ed and rude awakening is coming.  I had to call in a favor to a PCP that I rotated with as a student for him to see my grandmother, because every other practice in town was closed to new medicare.</p><p>In other news can we get a Celebration thread for John Edwards dropping out, Kevin.  I&#8217;m as giddy as a little school girl.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Anonymous</title><link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2008/01/arnold-kling-his-father-and-how.html#comment-83181</link> <dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator> <pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 19:42:00 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2008/01/arnold-kling-his-father-and-how-medicare-is-evil.html#comment-83181</guid> <description>Gasman, what are you talking about? Do you really think the &quot;AMA&quot; is going to have anything to do with deciding who and for what reasons applicants seek medical education? You are beginning to sound like some of the non-physician nutters who actually do think that organization has such power.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Graduates avoid those &quot;hands-on&quot; fields like geriatrics because they pay badly and for those who must be responsible for paying off their educational costs and everything else, bad pay is a non-starter. Maybe the Ohmeda machine is blocking your view of what goes on outside the hospital doors. Medical practice certainly is a business, and like any other business needs to pay its bills.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gasman, what are you talking about? Do you really think the &#8220;AMA&#8221; is going to have anything to do with deciding who and for what reasons applicants seek medical education? You are beginning to sound like some of the non-physician nutters who actually do think that organization has such power.</p><p>Graduates avoid those &#8220;hands-on&#8221; fields like geriatrics because they pay badly and for those who must be responsible for paying off their educational costs and everything else, bad pay is a non-starter. Maybe the Ohmeda machine is blocking your view of what goes on outside the hospital doors. Medical practice certainly is a business, and like any other business needs to pay its bills.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Anonymous</title><link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2008/01/arnold-kling-his-father-and-how.html#comment-83175</link> <dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator> <pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 17:29:00 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2008/01/arnold-kling-his-father-and-how-medicare-is-evil.html#comment-83175</guid> <description>The Baby Boomers are in for (literally) the surprise of their lives when become 65.  &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;They may think Medicare is great and generally &quot;free.&quot; In reality they have been irreversibly and unwillingly dumped into a third rate health plan that doctors avoid like the plague.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Suckers!&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Ed Sodaro MD</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Baby Boomers are in for (literally) the surprise of their lives when become 65.</p><p>They may think Medicare is great and generally &#8220;free.&#8221; In reality they have been irreversibly and unwillingly dumped into a third rate health plan that doctors avoid like the plague.</p><p>Suckers!</p><p>Ed Sodaro MD</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Gasman</title><link>http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2008/01/arnold-kling-his-father-and-how.html#comment-83173</link> <dc:creator>Gasman</dc:creator> <pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:24:00 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2008/01/arnold-kling-his-father-and-how-medicare-is-evil.html#comment-83173</guid> <description>So sadly true.  BJC is my home institution for work.  My grandmother was a patient there recently and I witnessed all of the distancing that is practiced with the elderly.  Though the practice of internal medicine as it is tought tends to behave this way with all patients, it is the elderly who suffer for it because they need more hands on care.  &lt;br/&gt;Some of the problem is that health care is a business, and like all businesses it dances to the tune of its payor.  &lt;br/&gt;But at its core, too many docs don&#039;t like patients, or at least have gotten themselves into areas of medicine where the population of patients selected is not to their liking.  &lt;br/&gt;I knew that elder medicine was not for me and wouldn&#039;t trade kids for anything.  &lt;br/&gt;Ultimately internal medicine, and the AMA as a whole are going to have to address this problem, by ensuring that from among the many qualified med-school applicants, they admit enough that really at their core want hands on care of the elderly.  Because that is where most physicicianing is going to be as the population ages.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So sadly true.  BJC is my home institution for work.  My grandmother was a patient there recently and I witnessed all of the distancing that is practiced with the elderly.  Though the practice of internal medicine as it is tought tends to behave this way with all patients, it is the elderly who suffer for it because they need more hands on care. <br />Some of the problem is that health care is a business, and like all businesses it dances to the tune of its payor. <br />But at its core, too many docs don&#8217;t like patients, or at least have gotten themselves into areas of medicine where the population of patients selected is not to their liking. <br />I knew that elder medicine was not for me and wouldn&#8217;t trade kids for anything. <br />Ultimately internal medicine, and the AMA as a whole are going to have to address this problem, by ensuring that from among the many qualified med-school applicants, they admit enough that really at their core want hands on care of the elderly.  Because that is where most physicicianing is going to be as the population ages.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> </channel> </rss>
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