Socialized medicine: “Great as long as you don’t need it”

For those wanting “free” health care – you get what you pay for:

Providing the high level of medical care that is expected by the American public is not cheap. Attempts to nationalize, socialize, quasi-socialize, or we-swear-we’re-not-going-to-socialize will do nothing to lower costs unless medical care is strictly and severely rationed.

Comments

Chris, RN
Oh! Scary. “socialized” medicine. Yeah, just think. You can walk into a doctor’s office or emergency room and get treated without getting prior approval from your insurance company. You will not get punished for going to a non-par, like getting stuck with a bill or refused treatment because you don’t belong. We are Americans. We deserve to have free health care like every other industrialized nation. It is a travesty and unconscionable to allow HMO’s to care more about their bottom line than about people’s lives and health. I know there are physicians out there reading this who sit on panels and deny care day after day. How does your conscious feel?
Anonymous
First of all it’s conscience. Second of all, did you read the post?
The healthcare system in America isn’t perfect, but socialized medicine isn’t a perfect solution either, as evidenced by the examples given by the author of the article.
We can’t let the government try and run every hospital and determine what drugs are helpful or not helpful, how much they should cost, how much doctors get paid, how many nurses get hired… but we also can’t let private and academic hospitals run the country.
There needs to be a balance of regulation and privatization for success in my opinion.
KoKo
” “socialized” medicine. Yeah, just think. You can walk into a doctor’s office or emergency room and get treated without getting prior approval from your insurance company”.
Walk right in…sit right down and wait, and wait and wait.
The wait times for many ER patients are so long, they eat lunch and dinner in the ER waiting room
With “socialized medicine”, the wait times could be so long, the patients will be waiting in sleeping bags and cooking 3 meals/day in the parking lot on little burners.
“Oh happy days”!
KoKo
“We deserve to have free health care “
BS!
You get what you pay for in this World.
Jaz
“you get what you pay for”
Really? Read The Comparative Performance of American Health Care which clearly shows the USA spending the most and getting the least.
This knee-jerk response about waiting times makes me laugh. I’ve lived in the UK, France and the USA, and all three have their issues, including waiting times.
I went to a top-notch ER in NYC this year with appendicitis. I waited four hours.
Everyone points to cancer care in the USA as being superlative, and no doubt it is, but apparently at the cost of a decent, accessible primary preventive care program.
Anyway, if you’d like to base your opinion on solid metrics and research, read the report.
May 15, 2007 (updated May 16, 2007)
Authors:
Karen Davis, Ph.D., Cathy Schoen, M.S., Stephen C. Schoenbaum, M.D., M.P.H., Michelle M. Doty, Ph.D., M.P.H., Alyssa L. Holmgren, M.P.A., Jennifer L. Kriss, and Katherine K. Shea
Editor(s):
Deborah Lorber
Anonymous
I’d be interested to hear from any physicians if they would move is a single payor system went down. I would probably move the day after the bill signed. Why would I live in rural Wisconsin if I would get paid the same to work in Fort Myers.
Panda Bear
You see, all I have to do is point out how bad the Greeks are at delivering health care through their socialized system and the socialized medicine zealots circle the wagons and start spraying meaninless statistics.
The fact is that in Greece, if you are really sick, old, poor, or any combination you are out of luck. The question needs to be, if the public hospitals are so goddamned good why do prosperous Greeks eschew them in favor of private hospitals, private doctors, and trips to the United States for medical care?
It’s simple. Because the Greek government spends only a third what we spend per capita on health care which doesn’t buy that much in the way of sophisticated medical care.
As I said, you get what you pay for. With the inefficiencies of socialized systems, systems from which the incentives for productivity have been removed,the Greeks couldn’t provide our level of care if they spent ten times what they currently do per capita.
Mike
“Everyone points to cancer care in the USA as being superlative, and no doubt it is”
Yeah, I wouldnt want top notch cancer care. It’s not like its the SECOND LEADING CAUSE OF DEATH IN THIS COUNTRY!
Sorry for the capitals.
Jaz
If you didn’t use caps, we wouldn’t know you’re angry )
Sure, cancer is the second leading cause of death. But we’re talking about efficiencies in the US system and those of other developed nations.
“You get what you pay for”. Are we saying that we pay for cancer to be the second leading cause of death? Or are we paying for cancer to have incidence rates up to twice those of the other developed nations?
The point I was making is that it is easy to point to one (highly profitable) sector of care in the US that far outclasses anything anyone else has to offer, and then we’re supposed to make the leap of faith that ergo the entire system must be the best in the world?
New York Times has a front-page piece on cost vs outcomes today. Might be worth reading.
–
And I’m still not saying socialised health care is the answer, I’m just saying the knee-jerk responses around the conversation are getting staler and staler.
Anonymous
Why in so few of these arguments do we not acknowledge the unhealthiness of the US public as part of the problem when trying to compare ourselves to the statistics of other industrialized nations?
I am an average height/weight person in the US – when I went to Singapore I was suddenly in the 99th percentile for height and obesity!
Let’s look at the whole picture…
Christina
I read these articles and wonder how many who respond are driven by the media and the few stories they hear. I have lived and experienced both the U.S. system and the Greek Socialized Medicine. In addition, I am in the medical field in the U.S. and can give you horror stories. What statistics do you want? The thousands of med-errors, denials of claims, insurances who drop you, and costs? Where could I begin? In Greece I never experienced a bad situation and my family actually came to Greece to complete several procedures that would have cost over $100,000 in the U.S. When it comes to prosthetics my father received one of his best ones in Greece.
We talk about cancer and all the other leading causes of death thinking our government and medical lobbies are not involved when huge corporations decide everyday which medicine for cancer or other terminal diseases will be used in the U.S. It is all about profit. Wait until the 4th and 5th tier medicine comes into play with insurance companies in the next year and meds that were covered for MS and certain cancers will not be covered. One of my clients can cost over one million dollars for a two week hospitalization and who pays for that? We do. There are thousands of people without insurance in the U.S. and many more to follow.
We focus on Greece yet there are other socialized countries with the U.S. actually being the only one without a form of it. Please be more open-minded and learn the facts about the different forms of socialized medicine. I am not for or against but do not agree with what is said when I have lived it. Experience is knowledge and without it we are tossed too and fro with every whim of every man.
Christina
After my blog yesterday, since I am now here in Greece vacationing, a family member had a medical emergency and we had to rush to the hospital here in Greece in Voula. The hospital was clean, the staff friendly and knowledgeable, and the care prompt. We were in and out in less than half-an-hour. The doctor was very alert, attentive to his patient, careful to hear the concern, and quick to diagnose the medical necessity, with great accuracy. I was impressed. This visit cost us nothing. In the U.S. this emergency visit would have taken longer(2hours at least) and even with insurance cost $100.00 and then the medicine which comes only in a name brand since there is no generic $55.00. I saw many other patients there all treated with respect.
I have to say that the experience was excellent and led to many discussions later with locals about the health care system in Greece. Out of 12 people sitting at our table for lunch of whom all but one have lived in the U.S., the consensus was that they would never change their universal system for what the U.S. has. There were mixed feelings about the U.S. and the care received by doctors and hospitals, in addition, to insurance problems.
In the end the final agreement was that a form of nationalized care for all people was necessary and private insurances could co-exist to cover serious medical issues and diseases which require specialists in the field. We all know that those are the very things private insurances try to avoid so a governing body is necessary for enforcement of care.
Christina
On my venture to one of the Greek islands I had the chance to talk to a French man who had questions about how health insurance works in the U.S. After a long discussion he stated with amazement that people in America must be struggling. He has full coverage and a private insurance to supplement the 25% remaining. He would never exchange that for nothing. He explained that the most of his friends and family were very happy with the care and could not imagine living in a country were they pay. These people know that their taxes go to pay for their needs and care. They are okay with that and understand the need to pay taxes.
In such a country as the U.S. where we have the opportunity to have everything and anything we have somehow missed the mark. Our strive for individualism has made us forget the people. I am thankful I found this blog because it has allowed me to do my own research with the people of Greece and France to learn how the system works for them. In addition, my own experience has proven that we are still wearing blind-folders and speaking without knowledge of how other countries truly operate. Change is good and we need to be willing for it or we will be left behind and be another fallen empire.