Comments on: Campaigning for President is tiring

By: Someonetc

Someonetc — Sun, 13 May 2007 00:15:00 +0000

i find it interesting when someone wonders how the 80hr work week will change the training of surgeons or question if they will be well trained, those in training or about to be in training scream, "how does sleep deprivation train you, it is counter productive."

for me the question is not the 80hr work week, it is do the adaptations to allow for the 80 work week decrease the number of cases (surgical) that residents see and does it prevent them from seeing enough of the rare cases.

residents today are different. is different better or worse. i don't know, time will tell.

By: Anonymous

Anonymous — Fri, 11 May 2007 12:14:00 +0000

The way they worked interns and residents back in the “old days” was counterproductive. It is a well established fact that sleep deprivation interferes with memory formation. I hardly even remember major stretches of my internship. My wife remembers dramatic clinical events from the stories I told her in the brief waking moments at home that I have no recall of at all. My instincts and reactions and intuitions were, I believe trained somewhat, but with regard to explicit memory, there is little. I remember my senior year and the first non killer schedule residency year (PG-3) very well, with clinical details and the lessons learned.

The 80 work rule was a needed response to abusive and counterproductive and dangerous schedules. I don’t want new docs to go through what I went through. Did I kill patients from fatigue? I don’t know. Ask my wife.

By: jb

jb — Fri, 11 May 2007 10:07:00 +0000

You will get surgeons who watch the clock to see when it’s time to go home, instead of surgeons who watch the patient to see when it’s safe to go home.

By: Anonymous

Anonymous — Thu, 10 May 2007 22:59:00 +0000

"Makes me wonder what kind of surgeons we're going to have in the future with the current work-hour restrictions in place."

The most recent forecast for my surgical subspeciality says that to be successful each MD will see 80 to 120 patients per day in the office and perform 5 surgeries per hour. It says that the relative value (relative to the price of gold) of the primary surgical procedure I perform has declined by 98.5% in the past 2 decades. It says that we will work longer hours to cover our overhead. Nobody regulates how many hours you work in private practice.

I, for one, am ready to throw my hat in the ring for the relatively easy job of President!

By: Aggravated DocSurg

Aggravated DocSurg — Thu, 10 May 2007 22:31:00 +0000

FWIW, Kevin, I agree with you wholeheartedly.

By: a tired Doc

a tired Doc — Thu, 10 May 2007 21:01:00 +0000

Give Kevin a break. It’s been a long day. Perhaps he’s tired…

By: Anonymous

Anonymous — Thu, 10 May 2007 19:54:00 +0000

this wonderful medical system made me work a THREE day STRETCH during my medical internship. yes thats right. i was on call or scheduled for 3 days straight. i did not go home from wednesday to friday morning. i had to ’switch’ a call with someone to get a day off a pregious week. so i had to double up . there were no mistakes. but by Thursday night. i was so tired that i went to sleep in a call room for about 4-5 hours. my ‘cheif’ let me. yes they knew that i was on for those many hours.but noone cared. this was in 1998. i dont think i learned anything from the expernience. do you think that 10 years later we can remember all the events during long calls ??? i dont think so. i think surgery is an exception where by you might actually do a surgery where there is a lot oflearning. otherwise. its time to shorten the work day. 24 hours is enough. surely we can find another person to take call and fill in another hour??>?

By: RJS

RJS — Thu, 10 May 2007 18:48:00 +0000

Makes me wonder what kind of surgeons we're going to have in the future with the current work-hour restrictions in place.

That's probably the dumbest bit of commentary I've ever seen you make.

Not having an 80 hour rule makes me wonder how many patients were killed in the past due to sleep deprivation.

Indeed.

By: Anonymous

Anonymous — Thu, 10 May 2007 18:37:00 +0000

That is the most stupid comment I have ever read, Kevin. I still work 80-100 hours a week. Many programs don’t observe the 80 rule and there are ways around it. But, so what if someone is only used to working 80 hours a week. Currently, the average surgeon only works 50-60 hours a week. How does 80 hours not prepare you?

Not having an 80 hour rule makes me wonder how many patients were killed in the past due to sleep deprivation.