Comments on: Single payer: Some common sense talk http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2007/03/single-payer-some-common-sense-talk.html Tue, 14 Feb 2012 21:09:00 +0000 hourly 1 By: Anonymoushttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2007/03/single-payer-some-common-sense-talk.html#comment-73412 Anonymous Fri, 30 Mar 2007 06:26:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2007/03/single-payer-some-common-sense-talk.html#comment-73412 Viv La Medicare! Last year, at 64, I was diagnosed with Breast cancer. No insurance, widow with about $250, 000.0 in pension plans. If I would go to an American hospital I would be a sitting duck for the money-grabbing financial office. I would have to subsidize all beggars coming to the ER for sore throat, and all the "negotiated rates" that private insurances force hospitals to accept.<br/>I opted to go abroad. Now I have Medicare Rx, a private insurance, and I see that they pay only about 25% of the going rates for all services (I get the reports!). So when the doctors lament about the dogs and their balls, they conveniently forget that those private insurance companies have been chewing on their collective scrotum from the beginning of days. The only difference is that 45% of population, the uninsured, either go without, or go abroad, or are forced to pay inflated fees. Viv La Medicare! Last year, at 64, I was diagnosed with Breast cancer. No insurance, widow with about $250, 000.0 in pension plans. If I would go to an American hospital I would be a sitting duck for the money-grabbing financial office. I would have to subsidize all beggars coming to the ER for sore throat, and all the “negotiated rates” that private insurances force hospitals to accept.
I opted to go abroad. Now I have Medicare Rx, a private insurance, and I see that they pay only about 25% of the going rates for all services (I get the reports!). So when the doctors lament about the dogs and their balls, they conveniently forget that those private insurance companies have been chewing on their collective scrotum from the beginning of days. The only difference is that 45% of population, the uninsured, either go without, or go abroad, or are forced to pay inflated fees.

]]> By: Evanhttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2007/03/single-payer-some-common-sense-talk.html#comment-73386 Evan Thu, 29 Mar 2007 15:09:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2007/03/single-payer-some-common-sense-talk.html#comment-73386 What's odd to me is this conversation seems to take place in a vacuum. Like nobody here has ever heard about civilized societies that solve this problem in other ways. Health care in Germany is different than it is in France, Italy, Belgium, Spain, Britain, Holland, Norway, Iceland, Japan or Korea. But all those countries give some version of universal coverage to their citizenry. Even though they use different means, they all seem to have functioning societies. Is it really true Panda, that you think ALL of them have such atrocious systems that the lives of both doctors and patients are substantially ruined by the dog on their balls? What’s odd to me is this conversation seems to take place in a vacuum. Like nobody here has ever heard about civilized societies that solve this problem in other ways. Health care in Germany is different than it is in France, Italy, Belgium, Spain, Britain, Holland, Norway, Iceland, Japan or Korea. But all those countries give some version of universal coverage to their citizenry. Even though they use different means, they all seem to have functioning societies. Is it really true Panda, that you think ALL of them have such atrocious systems that the lives of both doctors and patients are substantially ruined by the dog on their balls?

]]> By: Danhttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2007/03/single-payer-some-common-sense-talk.html#comment-73372 Dan Wed, 28 Mar 2007 23:18:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2007/03/single-payer-some-common-sense-talk.html#comment-73372 Correction to the numbers I posted above-- it looks like it's 13.6 million receiving employer-related insurance rather than the 11 million I mentioned; however, I don't feel this affects my point. Also, while I know that some people do choose their job based on health insurance benefits, I don't think that that is the driving force behind most career decisions. (I am looking at the resources at http://www.kff.org/medicare/index.cfm , for example the Medicare at a Glance pdf. ). Correction to the numbers I posted above– it looks like it’s 13.6 million receiving employer-related insurance rather than the 11 million I mentioned; however, I don’t feel this affects my point. Also, while I know that some people do choose their job based on health insurance benefits, I don’t think that that is the driving force behind most career decisions. (I am looking at the resources at http://www.kff.org/medicare/index.cfm , for example the Medicare at a Glance pdf. ).

]]> By: Danhttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2007/03/single-payer-some-common-sense-talk.html#comment-73371 Dan Wed, 28 Mar 2007 22:58:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2007/03/single-payer-some-common-sense-talk.html#comment-73371 Anonymous 5:07- I guess it's a subjective call as to which you would call a big dog and which you would call a small dog, but the numbers from the latest Kaiser reports are as follows: there's about 43 million people on Medicare. Of those, about 11 million retirees receive some sort of additional employer-sponsored insurance (and only a few people have other, non-employer-provided private insurance). I feel that saying Medicare is a tiny dog is incorrect.<br/><br/>Anonymous 5:25- We may have a difference of opinion regarding what should be considered a basic right, but as an American and as a health care provider I want certain things covered for all American citizens. For example, I wouldn't want doctors to tell some healthy 25 year-old that he's got to either A) spend down all his money and stop working so that he can be eligible for Medicaid (which would cost the public anyway) or B) not get his testicular cancer treated. And I definitely wouldn't want to tell him that his only choice is B (e.g., if there were no Medicaid). I wouldn't want to be a doctor in that type of society, and I wouldn't want a doctor who wanted that sort of society. Anonymous 5:07- I guess it’s a subjective call as to which you would call a big dog and which you would call a small dog, but the numbers from the latest Kaiser reports are as follows: there’s about 43 million people on Medicare. Of those, about 11 million retirees receive some sort of additional employer-sponsored insurance (and only a few people have other, non-employer-provided private insurance). I feel that saying Medicare is a tiny dog is incorrect.

Anonymous 5:25- We may have a difference of opinion regarding what should be considered a basic right, but as an American and as a health care provider I want certain things covered for all American citizens. For example, I wouldn’t want doctors to tell some healthy 25 year-old that he’s got to either A) spend down all his money and stop working so that he can be eligible for Medicaid (which would cost the public anyway) or B) not get his testicular cancer treated. And I definitely wouldn’t want to tell him that his only choice is B (e.g., if there were no Medicaid). I wouldn’t want to be a doctor in that type of society, and I wouldn’t want a doctor who wanted that sort of society.

]]> By: Anonymoushttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2007/03/single-payer-some-common-sense-talk.html#comment-73370 Anonymous Wed, 28 Mar 2007 22:25:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2007/03/single-payer-some-common-sense-talk.html#comment-73370 When did it become beyond debate that universal health insurance coverage is good? It seems to me that the value of insurance is a personal decision based on ones own risk aversion. When did we become so security obsessed as a culture that we not only seek to eliminate risk from our own lives but seek to forcibly compell others to spend their resources seeking security which they may not want. Not everyone is so unwilling to take risks that they feel a need to give up their freedom and wealth to insure themselves against all. Not everyone even wants healthcare when sick. Whose life is it anyway? When did it become beyond debate that universal health insurance coverage is good? It seems to me that the value of insurance is a personal decision based on ones own risk aversion. When did we become so security obsessed as a culture that we not only seek to eliminate risk from our own lives but seek to forcibly compell others to spend their resources seeking security which they may not want. Not everyone is so unwilling to take risks that they feel a need to give up their freedom and wealth to insure themselves against all. Not everyone even wants healthcare when sick. Whose life is it anyway?

]]> By: Anonymoushttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2007/03/single-payer-some-common-sense-talk.html#comment-73368 Anonymous Wed, 28 Mar 2007 22:07:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2007/03/single-payer-some-common-sense-talk.html#comment-73368 Medicare isn't a catastrophe becuase it is just one of the little dogs hanging on rather than the one big blood sucker. It rides on the back of private payors. If it were the only payor, there would be a crises the likes of which has never been seen in American medicine. Medicare isn’t a catastrophe becuase it is just one of the little dogs hanging on rather than the one big blood sucker. It rides on the back of private payors. If it were the only payor, there would be a crises the likes of which has never been seen in American medicine.

]]> By: Danhttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2007/03/single-payer-some-common-sense-talk.html#comment-73366 Dan Wed, 28 Mar 2007 22:04:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2007/03/single-payer-some-common-sense-talk.html#comment-73366 Panda Bear- Your reply was very dramatic, but didn't really add anything to any rational discussion. What is it about Medicare parts A and B that are terrible to the point that they would warrant a comparison to having one's testicles bit by a bulldog? Telling me that you "weep for me" because I "live in a cave" implies that it's patently obvious that Medicare A and B are working terribly. I don't doubt that there would be privacy concerns with government involvement. Nor do I doubt that there would be patients who would ultimately not get as good care under a single payer insurance system as they would under the current system. However, I do think that overall the economies of scale created by a system like Medicare A&B provide for a healthier population at less cost. And my impression from all those I've spoken to who have Medicare A & B is that while it's not a perfect system, it's also not subject to the terrible problems you seem to imply it should be. Panda Bear- Your reply was very dramatic, but didn’t really add anything to any rational discussion. What is it about Medicare parts A and B that are terrible to the point that they would warrant a comparison to having one’s testicles bit by a bulldog? Telling me that you “weep for me” because I “live in a cave” implies that it’s patently obvious that Medicare A and B are working terribly. I don’t doubt that there would be privacy concerns with government involvement. Nor do I doubt that there would be patients who would ultimately not get as good care under a single payer insurance system as they would under the current system. However, I do think that overall the economies of scale created by a system like Medicare A&B provide for a healthier population at less cost. And my impression from all those I’ve spoken to who have Medicare A & B is that while it’s not a perfect system, it’s also not subject to the terrible problems you seem to imply it should be.

]]> By: Anonymoushttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2007/03/single-payer-some-common-sense-talk.html#comment-73363 Anonymous Wed, 28 Mar 2007 21:41:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2007/03/single-payer-some-common-sense-talk.html#comment-73363 We have universal healthcare. EMTALA ensured that. Railing that our system is broken makes for great headlines, but the bottomline is there is nowhere I would rather be if me or one of my family members were ill. Stat geeks can quote all of the numbers that they want about the system's outcomes compared to other countries, but as long as we continue to be the fattest and laziest country in the world they might as well use the paper to wipe their backsides, because that's about all its good for. We have universal healthcare. EMTALA ensured that. Railing that our system is broken makes for great headlines, but the bottomline is there is nowhere I would rather be if me or one of my family members were ill. Stat geeks can quote all of the numbers that they want about the system’s outcomes compared to other countries, but as long as we continue to be the fattest and laziest country in the world they might as well use the paper to wipe their backsides, because that’s about all its good for.

]]> By: Anonymoushttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2007/03/single-payer-some-common-sense-talk.html#comment-73362 Anonymous Wed, 28 Mar 2007 21:35:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2007/03/single-payer-some-common-sense-talk.html#comment-73362 What about the poll last week that showed most americans want universal healthcare but they don't want to pay for it in increased taxes. That is the problem with our entire healthcare system in a nutshell. Everyone wants to be treated like an arabian sheik but are irate if they have to pay a dime out of pocket. What about the poll last week that showed most americans want universal healthcare but they don’t want to pay for it in increased taxes. That is the problem with our entire healthcare system in a nutshell. Everyone wants to be treated like an arabian sheik but are irate if they have to pay a dime out of pocket.

]]> By: Panda Bearhttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2007/03/single-payer-some-common-sense-talk.html#comment-73359 Panda Bear Wed, 28 Mar 2007 19:34:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2007/03/single-payer-some-common-sense-talk.html#comment-73359 Dan, you live in cave. Everything is about money and whoever writes the checks can do as they please, especially in representative governments where the mob can vote. The idea that everything is going to be all right and that goverenment is going to pay for your health insurance with no strings attached is so distant from reality that I weep, yes weep for you. Dan, you live in cave. Everything is about money and whoever writes the checks can do as they please, especially in representative governments where the mob can vote. The idea that everything is going to be all right and that goverenment is going to pay for your health insurance with no strings attached is so distant from reality that I weep, yes weep for you.

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