Comments on: Montanans Support Gov’t-subsidized Health Insurance http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2006/12/montanans-support-govt-subsidized.html Tue, 14 Feb 2012 21:39:00 +0000 hourly 1 By: Anonymoushttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2006/12/montanans-support-govt-subsidized.html#comment-69937 Anonymous Fri, 29 Dec 2006 03:57:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2006/12/montanans-support-gov%e2%80%99t-subsidized-health-insurance.html#comment-69937 from their perspective, of course it is ok to soak the rich; they're not you. from their perspective, of course it is ok to soak the rich; they’re not you.

]]> By: Anonymoushttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2006/12/montanans-support-govt-subsidized.html#comment-69926 Anonymous Thu, 28 Dec 2006 15:11:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2006/12/montanans-support-gov%e2%80%99t-subsidized-health-insurance.html#comment-69926 Well Said Gasman, I didn't think about it like that. But that begs the question, do you think they realize their pawning it off on other people? Is it a class-envy thing where its ok to tax the rich? Well Said Gasman, I didn’t think about it like that. But that begs the question, do you think they realize their pawning it off on other people? Is it a class-envy thing where its ok to tax the rich?

]]> By: Gasmanhttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2006/12/montanans-support-govt-subsidized.html#comment-69924 Gasman Thu, 28 Dec 2006 14:50:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2006/12/montanans-support-gov%e2%80%99t-subsidized-health-insurance.html#comment-69924 It's the free lunch thing.<br/>The majority of people pay less than the arithmetic mean amount of taxes; that is, taxation is skewed toward higher absolute amounts for higher earners.<br/>Thus it is no surprize that the majority would want government/taxpayer subsidized because it works out to be a bargain, pawning the full cost off on someone else. It’s the free lunch thing.
The majority of people pay less than the arithmetic mean amount of taxes; that is, taxation is skewed toward higher absolute amounts for higher earners.
Thus it is no surprize that the majority would want government/taxpayer subsidized because it works out to be a bargain, pawning the full cost off on someone else.

]]> By: Anonymoushttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2006/12/montanans-support-govt-subsidized.html#comment-69923 Anonymous Thu, 28 Dec 2006 14:45:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2006/12/montanans-support-gov%e2%80%99t-subsidized-health-insurance.html#comment-69923 I knew Montana was going down the slippery slope when it got rid of the "reasonable and prudent" speed limit. I knew Montana was going down the slippery slope when it got rid of the “reasonable and prudent” speed limit.

]]> By: Anonymoushttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2006/12/montanans-support-govt-subsidized.html#comment-69910 Anonymous Wed, 27 Dec 2006 23:45:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2006/12/montanans-support-gov%e2%80%99t-subsidized-health-insurance.html#comment-69910 It's me again. And I hate Ayn Rand.<br/><br/>But I always appreciate hearing other people's well-reasoned opinions. It’s me again. And I hate Ayn Rand.

But I always appreciate hearing other people’s well-reasoned opinions.

]]> By: Anonymoushttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2006/12/montanans-support-govt-subsidized.html#comment-69909 Anonymous Wed, 27 Dec 2006 23:28:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2006/12/montanans-support-gov%e2%80%99t-subsidized-health-insurance.html#comment-69909 Thank you Matthew, well said. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like you've read Atlas Shrugged . . . Thank you Matthew, well said. Correct me if I’m wrong, but it sounds like you’ve read Atlas Shrugged . . .

]]> By: Matthewhttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2006/12/montanans-support-govt-subsidized.html#comment-69908 Matthew Wed, 27 Dec 2006 23:23:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2006/12/montanans-support-gov%e2%80%99t-subsidized-health-insurance.html#comment-69908 I disagree... the fact that one of the options is unpalatable doesn't make it involuntary. Brute force (usually in the form of government) is the only way choices are genuinely involuntary. Purchasing health insurance is voluntary both in principle and in practice, although it seems clearly wiser to purchase it if it's available. Things like giving your money to someone who has a gun to your head, or on a related note, paying taxes to a government are genuinely not voluntary. Coercion is used. It's a very clear and real difference. I disagree… the fact that one of the options is unpalatable doesn’t make it involuntary. Brute force (usually in the form of government) is the only way choices are genuinely involuntary. Purchasing health insurance is voluntary both in principle and in practice, although it seems clearly wiser to purchase it if it’s available. Things like giving your money to someone who has a gun to your head, or on a related note, paying taxes to a government are genuinely not voluntary. Coercion is used. It’s a very clear and real difference.

]]> By: Anonymoushttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2006/12/montanans-support-govt-subsidized.html#comment-69904 Anonymous Wed, 27 Dec 2006 22:02:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2006/12/montanans-support-gov%e2%80%99t-subsidized-health-insurance.html#comment-69904 Trickeration indeed. :)<br/><br/>I could argue that my health insurance premium is in fact not voluntary. I have no say in the dollar amount nor in my co-pay and deductibles; my employer offers one option, take it or leave it.<br/><br/>If I opt not to enroll, then my "choice" is to be uninsured, with everything that entails.<br/><br/>So theoretically and in principle, it's voluntary... but in practice it's not.<br/><br/>Just for the sake of argument. ;) Trickeration indeed. :)

I could argue that my health insurance premium is in fact not voluntary. I have no say in the dollar amount nor in my co-pay and deductibles; my employer offers one option, take it or leave it.

If I opt not to enroll, then my “choice” is to be uninsured, with everything that entails.

So theoretically and in principle, it’s voluntary… but in practice it’s not.

Just for the sake of argument. ;)

]]> By: Matthewhttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2006/12/montanans-support-govt-subsidized.html#comment-69902 Matthew Wed, 27 Dec 2006 21:25:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2006/12/montanans-support-gov%e2%80%99t-subsidized-health-insurance.html#comment-69902 There's some truth there, but "subsidies" via voluntarily paid insurance are vastly different both in principle and in practice from involuntary ones through coercive government action.<br/><br/>It's funny how much of politics is terminology. Are they "late term abortions" or "partial-birth" abortions? Is it a tax or is it a revenue enhancement? Can I convince someone that government health care is "free" because you don't get billed at the time of service?<br/><br/>It's all trickeration, as the phrase goes. There’s some truth there, but “subsidies” via voluntarily paid insurance are vastly different both in principle and in practice from involuntary ones through coercive government action.

It’s funny how much of politics is terminology. Are they “late term abortions” or “partial-birth” abortions? Is it a tax or is it a revenue enhancement? Can I convince someone that government health care is “free” because you don’t get billed at the time of service?

It’s all trickeration, as the phrase goes.

]]> By: Anonymoushttp://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2006/12/montanans-support-govt-subsidized.html#comment-69901 Anonymous Wed, 27 Dec 2006 20:28:00 +0000 http://clients.emmense.com/kevinmd/2006/12/montanans-support-gov%e2%80%99t-subsidized-health-insurance.html#comment-69901 Well, we're subsidizing it anyway, aren't we? When uninsured and/or low-income patients can't pay their bill, the cost gets shifted to everyone else. When people don't get care because they can't afford it, and then present with conditions that are serious or advanced, the cost is higher. We're already paying for it indirectly; might as well let the providers recoup at least some of their costs and reduce some of the cost-shifting on everyone else.<br/><br/>If you really want to get technical, the entire concept of insurance is one giant subsidy. When I pay my premiums and deductibles and co-pays, I'm subsidizing everyone else in the risk pool. It may not be fair, but right now it's how the system works.<br/><br/>BTW, the working poor who are the most likely to qualify for subsidized insurance are paying taxes too. Well, we’re subsidizing it anyway, aren’t we? When uninsured and/or low-income patients can’t pay their bill, the cost gets shifted to everyone else. When people don’t get care because they can’t afford it, and then present with conditions that are serious or advanced, the cost is higher. We’re already paying for it indirectly; might as well let the providers recoup at least some of their costs and reduce some of the cost-shifting on everyone else.

If you really want to get technical, the entire concept of insurance is one giant subsidy. When I pay my premiums and deductibles and co-pays, I’m subsidizing everyone else in the risk pool. It may not be fair, but right now it’s how the system works.

BTW, the working poor who are the most likely to qualify for subsidized insurance are paying taxes too.

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