It seems to me that there should be no liability for any doctor for anything. The courts mostly hold that if it is a “complication” then it has some statistical certainty that it will happen every once in a while no matter how skilled or carefull the MD. At least that is what the critical care aministrator told us regarding the butcher that killed my mother by perforating her colon. We were kind tried to be understanding but when we refered to the event as the “mistake” we were “pimped” by the whole team. Well it wasn’t a mistake, he screw up. And when any else besides an MD screws up it is called a screw up and the conciqueces fall to their appropiate places. But in the case of an MD if we substitue the word complication for screw up we can simply eliminate the need for cause thus no need for blame and responsibility. You doctors at one time operated under a veil of total secrecy to the people you treated. If it were not for the FDA you would still be treating (killing) patients with quack medical appliances. Now you find that you spend way too much time worring about CYA from frivolus law suits. What about frivolus treatments and turning trusting old people into billing cash cows?
My mom did with out most of her life and saved $2000 to take care of her medical problems in her old age. HA! Of course we assured her that during all those weeks in the ICU were not dipping much into her money Ha! Ha! Ha!
This blog is very good. It has given me an insight into how and what medical professional REALLY think. However you all should be very carefull with all this human disclosure because it is what has put you into your current situation and that is public education. EVERYONE now knows what is going on – the insurance companies were first they cut out all your “pet” procedures and long drug out “services”. A few of your MD traitors even came up with better and less invasive procedures and to your dismay that is all you could get paid for. Alas one of the final organs for the medical profession to exploit is up Americas collective ass-hole. But this is a good thing because this too will come to pass and maybe the profession will be forced to be as responsible and liable as a car mechanic who regulary make mistakes but they have never tied to tell me it developed a complication.
I am in TV. I have spent a 35 year career helping others promote their products and themselves. I am as good at what I do as any MD reading this in their field.
I always felt a sence of accomplishment in what I did but never really felt like it helped mankind very much. My mother’s tragidy has made me determined to retire and use all the skills, friends and political capital I have aquired and focus it on as much public scrutiny on the corrupt and arrogant elements of the medical profession.
One old woman may just be a statistic and a 30 day medicare billing to you. But this one particular old woman may cost your profession more than you can imagine. Not from any court action but by the enlightenment of the public that MDs make MISTAKES like everone else. Even the biased court system that allows the theory of “complication” to overide responsibilty in medical cases.

Dr. Kevin
Thank you for providing this forum for discussion. You need not block my IP or be concerned about my future disruption of this forum, I will not be back.
I certainly hope MDs continue to find comfort and candid discussion at this and other sites. It is a facinating and educational window into your dark side, very much like listning to Dr. Hanible Lecter speak.
Your only curse now is that you will never be able to look at another ass-hole with out thinking of me first.
PS
Your profession REALLY needs to come up with a better term than “comfort therapy” it smacks too much of “pillow for your face mam?”

The solution to the problem of easily prevented/highly costly injuries is simple–deter the behavior strongly.

I suggest removing the kidneys of the surgeon/nurses/residents involved with the surgery–or maybe their children’s.

This would motivate doctors to take necessary precautions–in the same way the airplane pilots are motivated to adopt safety techniques: it makes the doctor’s intimate well-being tied to outcomes. The airline industry has achieved remarkable safety levels–so should the medical industry.

Anon 7:45…Why must you always be on the attack? Why does this person sound like she/he needs to be injured needlessly. Do you just pride yourself on hurting people who so obviously are already hurting?

Have you ever suffered even one small hurt in all your life? Were you sleeping during moral and ethics classes? Did your school not teach about compassion and dealing with upset family members.

Makes no difference because you aren’t really a doc!

Hell, he’s been letting one post here for months..

“My mom did with out most of her life and saved $2000 to take care of her medical problems in her old age.”

I hope there are 2 zeros missing from that number…

If not, the money would have been better spent on a psychiatrist and some haldol for the son.

Tell us more…how did the doc butcher your mom? Did he perforate the colon during a colonoscopy?

I am a doctor but I really don’t think I’m arrogant. What bugs me , is when someone, like the guy above, obviously in the “anger” stage of his mom’s death, lumps an entire population of people together because of what he construes as the malfeasance of one. I got stabbed by a “negro” when I was 15, should I hate all blacks? ALL YOU DOCTORS is a pretty wide term. But he seems to hate nurses, administrators, anyone unfortunate enough to support their family in healthcare. I hope nobody wanted to end your career when you broke their tv while tryng to fix it.

Organ perforation is a potential risk with most surgeries, is it not? I’m not a doctor, but I’ve signed many consent forms in my life for which that is listed as a rare possibility.

Was the “butcher” drunk or high on painkillers? Was he using the wrong instruments because he was too lazy to double check? Did he really not like your mother and just decided intentionally to kill her for the sport of it?

Or did the surgeon exercise all reasonable precautions and care, attempted to perform the procedure to the best of his ability, and yet it happened anyway.

No one can expect any doctor, or any human in any field, to be 100% perfect. We receive medical care knowing that it is being delivered by fallible humans. We can demand that these humans take their work seriously, use every bit of care and attention they have, but we cannot demand absolute perfection.

If one is unwilling to assume the inherent risk of trusting any human to perform a procedure, than one’s choices are to refuse medical care or learn to do surgery on themselves.

Very few people have the intellectual ability to become physicians, and for those who can, there are surely easier ways to make money (i.e. law school, business). There are plenty of well-paying jobs for smart people which do not require eleven to fifteen years of education and training! We’ll see what happens to the rest of the world when tomorrow’s brightest students decide the burdens of the job outweigh the rewards and there aren’t any doctors at all. .

I’m afraid “b” is confused and incoherent. Arrogance and self-importance has clouded his judgment–or maybe he’s not that bright. Let’s examine his “argument.”

“Why would you want to knowingly harm someone’s child if they made a mistake? Do you understand the difference between a mistake and malfeasance? (sp?)”

Two responses:
1. As it says in Exodus, “the sins of the father shall be visited upon the children unto the seventh generation” Do you dare question Mosaic law? Of course, you do, you’re an arrogant doctor.

2. Well, yes–under my proposal a few “innocent” children may be maimed–however, if that leads to the fewer people having this tragedy occur to them, isn’t it worth it? Indeed,wouldn’t we be morally obligated to remove the testicles, kidneys, breast of the children of those doctors who remove the wrong side organ? Doctors must taste the pain they inflict; only then will we get change.

“I don’t know one person who is independently wealthy who continues to work 80 hour weeks in the service of the public. We are all so beaten down, once there is a light at the end of the tunnel, most go do something else.”

Ohh–barf! Any stats on docs leaving medicine? Where is this exodus but in yr self-absorbed brain? There simply is nothing to support your claims.

You don’t work for the “public”; you work–like everyone else–for yourself. And that’s doctor’s problem. They insist upon seeing themselves as quasi-saints that they resist adopting the types of advanced management procedures that will save lives–as have pilots, etc.

“The reason doctors get paid alot of money is that we have to make very difficult decisions which carry high risks.”

Yes, precisely–and when you make an error, you should pay. Like a CEO who takes over a risky business–and will only stay in his position if he does well, a doctor should be rewarded if successful–and punished if he fails.

“When a sick person dies in a hospital or nursing home we call it malpractice.”

This is a lie. So few cases of malpractice go to trial–or are successful. Most victims of negligence do not sue. Get your facts straight, b.

“To the first commenter that missed his/her risperidol dose — No where in the original post did I see if refered to as a “complication”. Nor does it say anwhere that there were not sanctions.”

Does this mean that that sometimes doctors are sanctioned by his group or hospital?

” I hope nobody wanted to end your career when you broke their tv while tryng to fix it.”

I do not fix tvs I work for network TV and I have seen career dirctors loose their jobs for making one missed switcher button punch during a $250,000 commercial.
I also saw a news director loose her job for using the word NEGRO inapproiatly.
Crazy man

Crazy Man

I am sorry for venting and I am obviously in the wrong place to keep up intellectually.

Someone just please explain to me the difference between a complication and where you could say the MD did something wrong. You guys say that a perforated colon sometimes is just normal. What specifically would a MD person have to do or not do to say they they had made a true mistake? This is all that is unclear in my mind. (please expand but no arrogant comments or non layman terms just this once)

11:34

I am not a surgeon but I know a lot of them and some are jerks. But no one purposefully wants to cut bowel. There is twenty something feet of bowel packed into your abdomen that is usually in the way and on top of what you are trying to fix so it has to be held out of the way with instruments and my get pinched or damaged. It is wet, slimy, slippery and flops all around while you are holding a razor sharp instrument or buzzing things with electrocautery. There is blood everywhere covering things and making instruments more slippery. If you weigh 300# pounds then all that is in the way. It is quite amazing that it does not happen more. In medical school I remember farting while scrubbed into a surgery. The chief surgeon smelled it and thought he must have perforated bowel and started looking for a hole so I had to fess up to my crime.

Likewise a gastroenterologist is performing biopsies 2 and 1/2 feet inside the colon operating an instrument through a tiny video camera. You are taking a piece of tissue and have to get enough to have a meaningful biopsy without perforating the colon. But as they say, sometimes Shit Happens

TV Guy

“Mr. Network TV, guy who’s mom died of an ICU complication: I really didn’t need to see Janet Jackson’s Boob 2 years ago.”

This is an excellent example of how smart you think you are but totaly ignorant of reality. The next time you watch that JJ clip pay carefull attention to how skillfully the technical director cut to the “money” shot at just the right moment. Almost like everyone in the truck knew it was comming. Wow! The network overlooked that apparent coincidence and only fined Janet. After all it was Janet that had the costume malfunction – excuse me “costume complication”

Crazy man (me) was NOT the person that posted the biblical post. My mothers tragedy was human error but how do you ever get to the point of forgiveness if the perpertrator never can admit their mistake.
This is the key to the whole problem. We all make mistakes but the great and skilled intellect MDs that simply can never say “I screw up – I’m sorry” perpetuate the great wall. And it it this that makes MDs a target for peoples biblical vengence.

What the hell are you rambling on about?

Medical licenses are suspended and revoked all the time. Check your state board’s website. My old FP had to retire from practicing in my state because it was determined that he had a consentual sexual relationship with a patient (who later became his fiance).

Driver’s licenses are revoked for intentional illegal acts (DWI) or gross patterns of negligence leading to repeated citations. I can assure you a similar standard is in place with medical boards. We don’t strip people of their driver’s licenses because they are caught speeding once or accidently cause a collision.

“FYI there was no lawsuit. We refused to even talk to the hospital’s Risk Management. Me, my brother and dad paid for what MC and his insurance didn’t.”

You should have filed a lawsuit. You need to find out from a lawyer if you can still file a lawsuit.

On the other hand, I don’t believe this story. My gut feeling is that this man’s story is a fabrication to elicit response from doctors and I think he has
Borderline Personality.

“does kevin have liability if a mentally unhinged person posts on his blog and he doesn’t do anything about it?”

What if Crazy Man takes your specfic and labled diagnosis of his condition seriously?
What if he finds someones old prescription of HADOL as prescribed and posted here?
What if no one informs him that it very likely will effect his existing diabetic condition?
What if he dies as a result?
What if they seize kevins server?
What if the court finds that you guys are guilty of practicing medicine over the internet and from your hospital’s computer to boot?
What if they discover you were claiming to be working 80 hours a week on MC patients?
Where will this madness end?

Anon 7:06, if you cannot find all the obvious inconsistencies in the man’s writing,you won’t be able to understand. You, too, have a congenital neuron deficiency.